Wowzer! My head is exploding and I actually am stunned at all the intricacies. But if all this parsing and weaving and clarifying and tailoring and adapting and fine tuning get the man to SHUT UP at all, then it’s worth it.
It's complicated, but Joyce takes us so gently by the hand and leads us through the twists and turns. I found it extremely interesting, and each item was so clearly explained. I may not remember all of it tomorrow, but it was clear as I was reading it. Thank you, Joyce, for taking the time with us!
I may not remember it all 5 minutes from now! 🤣Joyce is absolutely brilliant and so thorough. Honestly she had me with the title: “Trump, Gagged Again”!
I do so appreciate the handholding. In this one-of-a-kind journey, pointing out the nuances and twists and turns is a great help to my understanding of what's happening. It also shows the respect Joyce has for her readers.
Won't happen...maybe at best two or three might grant cert, but I strongly believe - as I have said previously - they're onto his game, they have decided against him previously, and they are done with him, full stop.
I usually totally agree with your thinking, but Nah! Not buying into Koch backs Nikki or any body else!citizens United allows him to slather his money around through all his sleazy PACs and SuperPacs! It is safe to believe that some of his mega billions come from playing ‘the Wall Street short or long game’! In this case Nikki is his short position and the orange monster the long!
What do the gazillionaires think they would do if tRump went after them? He's railed against Amazon before. If he had a second term, it would be no holds barred.
He’s a wealthy, white-male criminal and politician. Most of those adjectives mean he has different and special justice that is not available to the rest of us.
You may have said it was long and deep but that's exactly what we appreciate the most. It's a chance for us to understand the complexities of the case and for us to more fully appreciate the 'system' as a whole. Thanks SO much and keep it coming. It's best when the electorate is informed and you're doing just that. We're most thankful.
In other common law jurisdictions - UK, Australia and others - even the type of comments now permitted to this defendant would be regarded as contempts of court. We don't allow defendants to make public attacks on the judicial system pending trial. Defendants who feel that a judge is biased may apply for recusal, and appeal if unhappy with the result. Whilst the civil or criminal process remains unfinalised, the parties and their lawyers are largely bound to public silence, although the press may report the content of documents filed and evidence given in court.
And another thing: the behaviour of this defendant's lawyers would likely in other places result in disciplinary action against them. We of the less advanced democracies don't generally favour allowing lawyers to put forward clearly untenable arguments and then attack the judges who reject them as politically biased. An Australian lawyer who publicly denigrated the judicial process at the behest of a client - as this person's lawyers frequently do - would have a very short career indeed. Perhaps we are over-affected by the quaint notion that the first duty of lawyers is to uphold the law.
Ken, I wish the law was like that here. To put it simply, Trump is being treated with kid gloves. So far, there is no equal justice under the law. Any other defendant would be in custody awaiting trial for what Trump has done.
He is certainly being treated better than the average felony defendant in, say, Louisiana. The gilded cage of Mar-A-Lago is probably more comfortable than Orleans Parish Jail.
US Laws are designed to be abused! As soon as a law is on the books, the bad guys ‘buy’ someone who helped write the law and knows its weaknesses! Case in point…several years ago UNC was potentially facing the equivalent of the NCAA death penalty for packing athletes into no show classes, emphases plural classes!! Their law firm hired one of the few NCAA investigators who provided all the loopholes to UNC’s legal team! End result, NCAA caved!! No show courses were not within their purview! By the way these courses dated back several decades!!!
I wonder what would happen if he goes to prison and meets a committee of Jan. 6ers in the exercise yard who are serving time because they listened to him?
Wow! A lot to take in. The Court is managing a landmine field. Their reasoning is thoughtful and consistent. Trump’s problem is that he can’t shut his mouth and his lawyers are incompetent when it comes to Constitutional law. I expect with this appeal and the presidential immunity appeal, the Supreme Court will not hear them and let the lower court’s ruling stand. Everyone wants this man to go away except the Crazies
I have to keep pinching myself, and reminding myself that you/we are talking about the former leader of the free world in a way that would make the most dangerous mob boss jealous.
Yes, I think it was a good win with the Gag Order, but we have a long road ahead before we can sleep, and it doesn't end until we reclaim the WH, the Senate, and the House. We must all unite: progressives, moderates, young, middle-aged, and old aged like me. We must stay together to defeat trump. Do NOT believe any of the 3rd party candidates who are being paid by Russia or trump's backers to draw votes away from the Democratic ticket. We WILL all lose, if trump regains the WH. carry on
This retired lawyer salutes you for your exceptionally clear and thorough explanation of this ruling. Thank you for being our law professor, our translator of legal-ese into plain language, and our common sense guide through this morass. Well done!
You mean nominee, right? He is a candidate, but I am going to predict that the election of November 5, 2024 may not be headlined by Trump or Biden. Remember LBJ, please. March 31, 1968.
And who would have thought that so many of our presidents would be who they were
- well in advance.
Dewey won! It was a headline!
Jimmy who?
George H. W. Bush had an 80% approval rating as president.
Bill who?
A young black first term Senator will win the presidency? Twice?
A bombastic real estate con man who is hated by most of the people in his home city???
We spend our lives preparing for things that don't happen. But prepare and beware.
Thanks again Joyce. Lengthy to be sure but equally easy to understand your breakdown.
We all will need lots of adult refreshments in the coming months to take the edge off the daily onslaught of disinformation coming from TFG’s legal drama.
Nothing can convince me now, that the Justice system is not treating him differently. He and his lying foul mouth belong in jail. And, while I'm at it let the DOJ and the rest of the justice system tell us why Gen. Flynn, Bannon, his boy Stephen, Meadows, and others have not had their trials already and in prison. You do a great job helping us reg citizens to understand, but that still does not make it right. As far as I am concerned, our DOJ and the rest of the justice system is doing for Trump what the media did in 2016 and in most cases continue to do. He is giving all of these folks who are giving him a long rope and media space the middle finger and it may just be at our peril.
The DOJ dragged its feet far too long. This prosecution could have begun a year earlier. Forced Jack Smith to take to the air immediately instead of getting a chance to roll, gather speed and then launch upward. He and his crew have done a remarkable job so far. They are torchbearers for all of us.
I have to trust that you are right MaryPat, I want to see him rot in jail surrounded by his minions, let that be the last we hear about them until the obituaries start showing up.
I agree that the DOJ, or the Special Prosecutor, is doing their job. Trump cleverly began his “campaign” close to a year ago, so that he could play the First Amendment free speech card again and again, and claim election interference. Waiting until this year to file charges against him gave him a small measure of credibility for his claims of selective prosecution and election interference. In my opinion, the delay should not make any difference; but for the life of me, I cannot understand the mindset of the “base” who appear cultlike. Are there really that many people who are permanently enthralled by anger and fear wrapped around bigotry and disrespect? What is the core value-is it self-pity? is it hero worship because they believe that a wealthy person actually cares about their plight? who wants to follow a preacher of hate, fear and anger? Who is so bereft of hope and faith that they believe that a campaign and an administration of reprisals will somehow even the score and give them glorious satisfaction? There appear to br far too many Americans who believe that their country has let them down. A sad, sorry lot who see this criminal defendant as their savior. I dunno….
Wowzer! My head is exploding and I actually am stunned at all the intricacies. But if all this parsing and weaving and clarifying and tailoring and adapting and fine tuning get the man to SHUT UP at all, then it’s worth it.
It's complicated, but Joyce takes us so gently by the hand and leads us through the twists and turns. I found it extremely interesting, and each item was so clearly explained. I may not remember all of it tomorrow, but it was clear as I was reading it. Thank you, Joyce, for taking the time with us!
I may not remember it all 5 minutes from now! 🤣Joyce is absolutely brilliant and so thorough. Honestly she had me with the title: “Trump, Gagged Again”!
I do so appreciate the handholding. In this one-of-a-kind journey, pointing out the nuances and twists and turns is a great help to my understanding of what's happening. It also shows the respect Joyce has for her readers.
I don’t want him to shut up. I just want his jail time for contempt when he blabbers to be so iron clad it will not be overturned.
I just fear that the Supremes are in his pocket. That is my greatest concern.
Won't happen...maybe at best two or three might grant cert, but I strongly believe - as I have said previously - they're onto his game, they have decided against him previously, and they are done with him, full stop.
Plus, the Republican Supreme Court Judges' financial backers have dumped trump, so their "instructions" will be to rule against him.
One can only hope
I usually totally agree with your thinking, but Nah! Not buying into Koch backs Nikki or any body else!citizens United allows him to slather his money around through all his sleazy PACs and SuperPacs! It is safe to believe that some of his mega billions come from playing ‘the Wall Street short or long game’! In this case Nikki is his short position and the orange monster the long!
What do the gazillionaires think they would do if tRump went after them? He's railed against Amazon before. If he had a second term, it would be no holds barred.
Prepare yourself for the fact that he’s never going to serve a day behind bars and he knows it.
America is 247 years old. I’m 77 years old. Neither of us have learned enough to be prepared for such an eventuality.
We both need clarity. Closure. A final rest from the Trump show.
This is where I say fine with me so long as he never "serves" a day in the Oval Office.
He needs to go to jail! He has committed treason many times over. Julius and Ethel Rosenburg were executed for less than what tRump has done.
I don’t disagree. I never believed he would become president in the first place. So now I am being realistic and managing my expectations.
He’s a wealthy, white-male criminal and politician. Most of those adjectives mean he has different and special justice that is not available to the rest of us.
Tragic!
Never. 👎
You may have said it was long and deep but that's exactly what we appreciate the most. It's a chance for us to understand the complexities of the case and for us to more fully appreciate the 'system' as a whole. Thanks SO much and keep it coming. It's best when the electorate is informed and you're doing just that. We're most thankful.
This is an excellent analysis; thank you!
In other common law jurisdictions - UK, Australia and others - even the type of comments now permitted to this defendant would be regarded as contempts of court. We don't allow defendants to make public attacks on the judicial system pending trial. Defendants who feel that a judge is biased may apply for recusal, and appeal if unhappy with the result. Whilst the civil or criminal process remains unfinalised, the parties and their lawyers are largely bound to public silence, although the press may report the content of documents filed and evidence given in court.
And another thing: the behaviour of this defendant's lawyers would likely in other places result in disciplinary action against them. We of the less advanced democracies don't generally favour allowing lawyers to put forward clearly untenable arguments and then attack the judges who reject them as politically biased. An Australian lawyer who publicly denigrated the judicial process at the behest of a client - as this person's lawyers frequently do - would have a very short career indeed. Perhaps we are over-affected by the quaint notion that the first duty of lawyers is to uphold the law.
Ken, I wish the law was like that here. To put it simply, Trump is being treated with kid gloves. So far, there is no equal justice under the law. Any other defendant would be in custody awaiting trial for what Trump has done.
He is certainly being treated better than the average felony defendant in, say, Louisiana. The gilded cage of Mar-A-Lago is probably more comfortable than Orleans Parish Jail.
US Laws are designed to be abused! As soon as a law is on the books, the bad guys ‘buy’ someone who helped write the law and knows its weaknesses! Case in point…several years ago UNC was potentially facing the equivalent of the NCAA death penalty for packing athletes into no show classes, emphases plural classes!! Their law firm hired one of the few NCAA investigators who provided all the loopholes to UNC’s legal team! End result, NCAA caved!! No show courses were not within their purview! By the way these courses dated back several decades!!!
I wonder what would happen if he goes to prison and meets a committee of Jan. 6ers in the exercise yard who are serving time because they listened to him?
Wow! A lot to take in. The Court is managing a landmine field. Their reasoning is thoughtful and consistent. Trump’s problem is that he can’t shut his mouth and his lawyers are incompetent when it comes to Constitutional law. I expect with this appeal and the presidential immunity appeal, the Supreme Court will not hear them and let the lower court’s ruling stand. Everyone wants this man to go away except the Crazies
I have to keep pinching myself, and reminding myself that you/we are talking about the former leader of the free world in a way that would make the most dangerous mob boss jealous.
UNBELIEVABLE, yet here we are.
Perfect conundrum we find ourselves in because on one narcissistic, petulant man child.
And too many willing to shake on the Faustian bargain.
Supposed leader of the free world. Most valued allies loathed him!
Thank you so much. Going back for a reread, with some eggnog and tylenol.
Thanks for your wonderful analysis, Joyce.
Yes, I think it was a good win with the Gag Order, but we have a long road ahead before we can sleep, and it doesn't end until we reclaim the WH, the Senate, and the House. We must all unite: progressives, moderates, young, middle-aged, and old aged like me. We must stay together to defeat trump. Do NOT believe any of the 3rd party candidates who are being paid by Russia or trump's backers to draw votes away from the Democratic ticket. We WILL all lose, if trump regains the WH. carry on
Phew that was a lot to digest. and agree needs to be reread a few times. bottom line it appears the days of reckoning are
on the horizon for Trump. Let’s hope so!!
This retired lawyer salutes you for your exceptionally clear and thorough explanation of this ruling. Thank you for being our law professor, our translator of legal-ese into plain language, and our common sense guide through this morass. Well done!
I am not a lawyer, and I understand your points, but really, doesn't this just come down to a couple of things:
1- the appelate needed to give Trump a few small things so that SCOTUS would/will have a harder time dismissing this as partisanship
2 - Jack Smith must have government-provide protective services, unlike many court employees etc.
I'm getting tired of the deference that this a**hole gets.
It strikes me that it is premature to consider Trump a candidate; at this point he is merely an aspirant (as am I, though I'm not polling well).
You mean nominee, right? He is a candidate, but I am going to predict that the election of November 5, 2024 may not be headlined by Trump or Biden. Remember LBJ, please. March 31, 1968.
And who would have thought that so many of our presidents would be who they were
- well in advance.
Dewey won! It was a headline!
Jimmy who?
George H. W. Bush had an 80% approval rating as president.
Bill who?
A young black first term Senator will win the presidency? Twice?
A bombastic real estate con man who is hated by most of the people in his home city???
We spend our lives preparing for things that don't happen. But prepare and beware.
Haley vs Newsom anyone?
He is a candidate right now.
Har!
Gag gag a re-gag a gag bam boom.
As an ex police officer, and advised so very well by Joyce, I do have a good understanding of the rulings by both courts.
The one single statement he was absolutely not prohibited from making is “I am not guilty,”.
We have not heard him say that at all.
Innocent people offer simple, concise denials.
Guilty people obfuscate and guild the Lilly.
Gild
Thanks again Joyce. Lengthy to be sure but equally easy to understand your breakdown.
We all will need lots of adult refreshments in the coming months to take the edge off the daily onslaught of disinformation coming from TFG’s legal drama.
Prayers that we all survive it🙏🏼☮️🙏🏼
Nothing can convince me now, that the Justice system is not treating him differently. He and his lying foul mouth belong in jail. And, while I'm at it let the DOJ and the rest of the justice system tell us why Gen. Flynn, Bannon, his boy Stephen, Meadows, and others have not had their trials already and in prison. You do a great job helping us reg citizens to understand, but that still does not make it right. As far as I am concerned, our DOJ and the rest of the justice system is doing for Trump what the media did in 2016 and in most cases continue to do. He is giving all of these folks who are giving him a long rope and media space the middle finger and it may just be at our peril.
The DOJ dragged its feet far too long. This prosecution could have begun a year earlier. Forced Jack Smith to take to the air immediately instead of getting a chance to roll, gather speed and then launch upward. He and his crew have done a remarkable job so far. They are torchbearers for all of us.
"Ralph Waldo Emerson — 'When you strike at a king, you must kill him.'
The DOJ did exactly what needed to be done, as quickly and efficiently as it could be done, to assure conviction.
I have to trust that you are right MaryPat, I want to see him rot in jail surrounded by his minions, let that be the last we hear about them until the obituaries start showing up.
DOJ is doing their job, and we have to do ours. Such a scary time.
I agree that the DOJ, or the Special Prosecutor, is doing their job. Trump cleverly began his “campaign” close to a year ago, so that he could play the First Amendment free speech card again and again, and claim election interference. Waiting until this year to file charges against him gave him a small measure of credibility for his claims of selective prosecution and election interference. In my opinion, the delay should not make any difference; but for the life of me, I cannot understand the mindset of the “base” who appear cultlike. Are there really that many people who are permanently enthralled by anger and fear wrapped around bigotry and disrespect? What is the core value-is it self-pity? is it hero worship because they believe that a wealthy person actually cares about their plight? who wants to follow a preacher of hate, fear and anger? Who is so bereft of hope and faith that they believe that a campaign and an administration of reprisals will somehow even the score and give them glorious satisfaction? There appear to br far too many Americans who believe that their country has let them down. A sad, sorry lot who see this criminal defendant as their savior. I dunno….