I flew home tonight from a lovely long weekend in Boston with my husband and daughter but wanted to take a few minutes to write to you tonight, nonetheless. Forgive me if my thoughts are less formal than usual. I continue to be deeply troubled by the openness with which Donald Trump expresses an anti-democratic vision for his hoped-for future presidency and the reporting about just how far along the planning is. Over the last few days we’ve read details that include
Joyce: Thank you for your courage in continuing to speak out and inform. I do not use the word “courage” lightly because the threat is real and you bravely continue to fight for our country.
I have concerns about what possibly could happen to individuals like Joyce and her colleagues (both public and private) who speak the truth if Trump were to be elected president.
No Steve, trump has articulated what *will* happen should he find himself president again. He doesnt waffle. The “could happen” hinges on whether he finds himself president again. It isnt just Joyce or other outspoken people Conway, Tribe, Biden, Luttig etc, its anyone who has donated to AOC or Bernie or anyone not supporting trump, because no doubt hacking the servers of the liberal fundraising groups wont be difficult. Or anyone “liking” something anti trump on social media, and most likely, anyone in public who isnt obviously white. The Arab Americans who say they wont support Biden, are they so delusional that they think that the trumpMagapublican thugs wont round them up too? Or any conservative voting person of color, hello Lantino community and Cubans who vote for Republicans? Nope be prepared to be rounded up, deported, tortured, killed. Thats what is at stake.
Upholding a democracy is not easy, it is messy business. We have history to show us how often we have had to struggle to achieve a modicum of the plan - the US Constitution.
I needed to stop reading Ruth Ben-Ghiat (paused the membership) but there's a list that the koch bros. created. I don't remember what it's called but it's the crap out of hitler and mussolini. Ruth's name is on it. I'm sorry, I couldn't find it but I have in the past (it's on Ruth's Lucid and I managed to find it on the internet). When rump was put in the oval office, my spouse told me not to write anything that was bad about what was happening because it could be traced to me. That was seven years ago and it's too late :) . We type truth to lies.
Thom Hartmann here describes being in prison with fellow writers like Heather Cox Richardson. Yes, "Joyce Vance" would be on that trump list, too. We have much work to do to save our democracy and our courageous writers.
Time to put it on the backs of the RNC. I hope everyone will be in touch with Ronna & her cabal & ssk if they support Trump's stated plans if not what are they going to do about it??
You are right Tim!! Every person appearing to support Trump should be asked that question. And pushed back on when they try to deflect with “I don’t comment on political candidate speeches” and “I didn’t see or hear his speech yet”. They are supporting him and that is the only way he keeps his power. If more and more Republicans had to answer for their support of his fascist rhetoric, maybe the tide would turn to more Republicans standing for democracy. And maybe the Trumpians would slowly come to see the light.
Bruce, I think it's too late as well. Saw this coming in dots for a couple decades. The dots are now connected. "Hope" is a useful too but I'm not sure I believe in it. We've all seen too much and I don't know how in the hell to turn this around. We'd have to deAll I can do is inform and that's all I'm doing.
Sorry, took a stroll through the internet (can't find the list - I"m sure it's in Ruth's "Lucid".
In all cases of history that I have studied in my book "Strongmen," people did not take the various Hitlers and Mussolinis seriously until it was too late.
I think I saw it in Chop Wood, Jessica Craven...Hope: I think God is too busy trying to inform the "C"ristians why He wanted a new covenant, to answer our prayers
Unless I am behind bars or lying in the gutters, it cannot be too late. The stakes are just that important for everyone, including those Rs and voters who don’t speak out.
Nice John, but how about ten days before you are hauled in? Then you can resist, and aren't just a lamb for the slaughter. Of course, "the meek shall inherit the Kingdom"...and those lambs did offer us their sacrifice as a warning...To not leave it fester too long before we act against the evil.
Hey, Valere! Good seeing ya! I intended to reply to your query about my name the other day but got sidetracked.
So...Wineaux...is not a surname. It’s actually a portmanteau from combining wine (or wino) + Bordeaux. 🍷
I’m a retired SW engineer, but I’m also a >wine educator<. So, there you have it! Oh, wait! I should prob say that since following Joyce, Andrew Weissmann, Neal Katyal, & so many brilliant, legal minds, I’m seeing myself also as an armchair law student or a 1L. 😉
I chuckled when I saw your chosen handle because a good friend of many years has used it for her email address handle. We were fellow students abroad in France, in the early 60s, and her choice certainly refers to her love of wine.
Hey, that’s very cool! I didn’t begin traveling to France until 2012, and completely fell in love. Brushed off and improved on my high school French, and thus made several trips since then ... mainly Paris, Reims, Versailles.
But, recently (April/May) spent about a month in Tours (Loire Valley) visiting a friend, & FINALLY got to Bordeaux. Got a chance to practice my limited French...I got better. 😬
Thank you Wineaux, I have a friend who is a wine educator as well:) I'm a teetotaler but since my friend is a wine educator, your name caught me. I'm also a Joyce Vance 101 student.
Rachel Maddow said exactly that...The RNC is the only entity that can put a stop to Trump now. Every day they keep endorsing him sets the country back further and further and will allow him to damage our democracy further. This mess is totally the Republican Parties doing and we need to vote them out of office ASAP.
I eagerly await the day a reporter replies to McDaniel's kind of evasion with, "DT lies and threatens American democracy. How do you live with yourself?"
Well, first off I await that kind of reporter's reply to any number of statements by GOP members discussing DT, not just RNC management. This is just one example. Secondly, McDaniel's claim that it's not her job is a bs denial of her responsibility to support candidates who're not dangers to the Republic, her "job" be damned much less what she thinks her job might be.
As I wrote, I'm not holding my breath waiting to hear this has happened.
Isn't a no comment as good as saying: This guy is nuts but I'm a chicken shit & I'm afraid of Trump??? Sometimes a no answer us as powerful as word salad!
Ronna wants to keep her job! However, Trump has her number! She will be replaced and perhaps deleted entirely in months ahead. Trump knows McDaniels is wobbling in support of him. She dropped Romney from her name years ago even if it helped her get the GOP/RNC job! Do you have any room at your Thanksgiving table?
Oh, the RNC is fully behind him. They are not going to be any help. Right thinking Republicans (if there are any left) simply need to break with their former party which has become unrecognizable. And they need to go public with it.
The RNC doesn't matter. They have no influence on DJT or his fanatical supporters. They also know that to say anything negative about "the chosen one" is a completely useless and self-destructive move.
25 years ago if you told me DJT would become president I would have laughed and maybe thought u were crazy or just really dumb. Today I’m dumbstruck scared for democracy. I also feel like I’m ready to pass 1st year law school classes from reading Joyce Vance’s daily Substack!
I think most people who lived and/or grew up in New York wouldn’t have imagined that Trump would be president. He showed his colors early on and for the most part, was not liked. I think that “leak” from Jenna Ellis is telling but not surprising. He wants to be king, to rule forever. The sooner we rid ourselves of this lunatic, the better we will be. We have a difficult situation in that Biden will run again and so many people who voted for him the first time, may not vote for him again. Add to that a third party and we have a troubling situation. We ALL must vote, but in addition, we must do all we can to get citizens to vote and not pass up this incredibly important election. Biden has been the best president in my lifetime and I would vote for him again. I’m overseas with my family for the next month, but when I get back home I will be very proactive again with Vote.org. No matter what happens in the next election, Trump will say he won so we’d better be prepared and not allow him to win.
My concern with peoples' caviling about Biden's age is that anyone can have a health issue at almost any age. Is it more likely with someone 81 years old? Hack yes, I'm 82 and growing old is not for sissies. But people in good health die at much younger ages from all sorts of causes, like stepping in front of the the No. 10 bus from Dubuque..... The thing is that right now the world has decided to come unglued all over the place, and there is no one else currently in the Democratic Party with the foreign policy experience and personal contacts and relationships Joe Biden has. It is a resource that may keep some of these eruptions from detonating into major conflicts. There are several talented younger Democratic future candidates, but in 2024 I'll stick with the geezer who also has the finest medical care available to him as POTUS..... And does anyone REALLY believe that Donald Trump is in better condition at 77? Joe Manchin at 76? When I look at what Biden has been able to do with a hostile opposition and a razor-thin majority in the Senate, I ask myself, "Where do we get such men.....?"
He seems to be in pretty good health. And right, any age can suffer ill health Fetterman being a prime model. (A soap box comment: stop eating animal products they cause all the diseases and stroke and heart issues), anyway, no on who isnt sexist or racist should have a problem with the Biden-Harris ticket because if he has a health issue we have Kamala. Again any Democrat whining about his age is likely sexist or racist. It is an entire administration, her values are his values at this level, they have an amazing group of people working together with the goal to assist the American people to have a better existence. Thats all anyone needs to vote on regarding Biden.
When people want to talk about Biden’s age, vitality and health as opposed to trump’s, I advise them to picture trump on a bicycle. And I’m not even considering the fact that he would refuse to wear a helmet because it would mess up his “perfect” hair.
Betsy, Trump looks like he is wearing a girdle or complete set of spanx beneath his suits when he goes to court - from the golf course where he looks grossly obese. He truly is in terrible shape.
Thank you Bruce, for distilling this argument so concisely. I just shared your words with a friend who is working on convincing her friends who are Republicans, hate trump, but think Biden is "too old".
Thank you, I don't understand how 5 US Code 7311 isn't enforced, it would seem to apply as he's crossed the threshold for advocating the overthrow of our Constitutional form of government at least two times now.
Thank you Shire & the Cornell Law school for text of 5 USC 7311 & all its subsections:
Section (1 ) tfg has made an express oral & written admission of killing our democracy ✔️
Section (2) tfg leads what's left of R's who are advocating fascism ✔️
Section (3) we will see this coming Friday if 'no budget' and/or choked funding amounts to a "strike" led by an advocate of state religion. & its Pharisee cult Leader. ✔️
I need to research the the fascist admissions' possible impact on Colorado's pending Court decision on barring tfg from the Colorado 2024 Presidential Election ballot as well as Jack Smith's use of the Defendant's seditious admissions in the J6 case.
Could this develop into an outcome of the Courts' willingness to let him ramble "on the record"? As a novice observer to the legal procedures, I live in hope that Jack Smith et.al. will fold this into the proceedings.
Judge Engoron has let the Defendant 'ramble' or rant but, has obtained evidence from Fraudster & Sons direct knowledge of the fraudulent "terms" & "deals". The Judge is the trier of admissible facts. There is no jury.
To listen and to hear are two different things! Trump was told by ALL around him and never listened because Trump did not want to admit his failing! Pathetic beast who is dragging down our wonderful Nation! Kick him to the curb! VOTE! Or get what you deserve!
I do not know how Trump is still alive — diet alone should have gotten him by now. And don’t we have any snipers in our special forces? He should receive the same treatment he has been threatening so many with — isn’t OUR constitutional duty to protect our democracy from him and his cronies?
A stupendous irony rarely mentioned is that if the alt-right gets the authoritarian government they want, it will within three years take away their precious guns. With all the "vermin" in camps, the new Freedom Republic of America will declare no further need of an armed citizenry. Those who object will join the vermin.
What these idiots don't realize is that it's the *liberals* who are safeguarding such rights.
It’s not Trump himself who frightens me, although he can certainly whip a crowd into a frenzy of murderous and mindless destruction.
Rather, I am concerned there is another person who is much more intelligent, more disciplined, and more capable of directing the masses toward toward the annihilation of our democracy. Consider that there is new Hitler somewhere in our midst. If someone as talentless and dumb as Trump can cause this much damage, think of the destruction someone with brains and evil intent could do.
Be wary. Consider how we as a society can prevent this from happening.
Yes. It’s my opinion that McConnell and Ryan and others before Trump were already working toward a quiet overthrow. They also wanted permanent one-party control but veiled in “democracy”. Trump stumbled onto the fertile soil they had been cultivating and took full advantage. But he doesn’t do subtlety. One party control is ok but one man control is better -- and only one man in particular. Institutional violence is ok but physical violence is better, being on the jackboots.
Hi Kathy, just a time-saving tip - go to the three dots, at the bottom, right side of your post. Poke on that and select 'edit' - then you can edit the post such as changing to 'bring'
I believe that if somehow trump is _not_ the R nominee, whoever it is will use the same playbook. They may not entirely be OK with it, but they will be told that they will lose R support if they don't follow it. That is why we _must_ elect Biden, no matter what.
Keep your eye on Elon Musk! Cannot run for office since born in South Africa but is an American citizen. He is a clever sleuth and ultra ambitious for himself. Musk travels “underground” and has been highly successful obtaining U.S. grants to further himself. Furthermore, he is anti democracy and anti Constitution. A loner in our lands and society.
How disappointed they'll be when donald loses! I hope that he does win the primary-- it will shock the whole country and wake up all the lapsed and indifferent voters.
💙 We are in this together!! And the primary will be what it is:)) It would be wonderful to see him booted from the primaries - but he will not be president.
As a senior citizen, I'm just as worried, but I'm too worried about my grandchildren. They're in school, so they may not even learn about Hitler, Stalin, or even Putin if history books become "extinct," or especially if history or social studies classes are no longer taught.
Jen Psaki was dynamite. The issues we face are clear. We must do all we can to dissuade any and all people we know the danger of backing a third party or independent candidate. Forwarding Joyce's, Rick Wilson's TCinLA, Robert Hubble and Heather's Substacks to all we know who my be unconcerned, wobbling or ignorant must be done also.
It's true that a certain percentage of this country are going to be "Always Trumpers" despite any facts that come to light pertaining to his plans, his behavior, his culpability, or his open disdain of all the "American" values he professes to embrace. If he were to die of natural causes tomorrow, they would blame someone, find a plot, and turn him into a martyr. At this point, I consider it the duty of every eligible voter who dislikes Trump to vote against him should he become the nominee, and to vote against every would-be mini Trump who espouses the same poisonous and dangerous rhetoric and policies. I too am exhausted by the spite, vindictiveness, petty jealousy, insatiable need for attention, proud ignorance, and boasting of the man who wants to destroy everything that doesn't reflect a flattering portrait of himself.
But I tell myself that all it (should)! take to defeat him is to remember that the 30% of "Trump voters" don't reflect the desires of the majority, and that if the majority rejects Trumpism and turns out to vote against him, we just might start on the road to better times.
And the hate within his followers wont abate. From here on out for years, democracy loving Americans will need to be on guard, for the likes of trumps enablers and the far right maga christofascists will continue to find weak places to get in and try their hand at gaining power
That was a tough one to read and even rougher to write. I have been very worried of late about this wind of hate that is brewing in the country. It is even more distressing when one knows they are in with the "vermin", You certainly are, as am I. We have got to get involved in our democracy to end this threat with the vote. If it is contested it will mean blood in the streets, which is what the Nationalist militias want. The far right is on the wrong side of history, but they are so militant about being right. Time to sleep but not restfully...
When I saw trump’s Veteran’s Day screed, immediately had two thoughts. First, his “message” to veterans felt eerily and terrifyingly like the “stand down and stand by” one to the proud boys in 2020 -- an appeal for the current and former military to be his storm troopers. Second, I wondered why the media is not reporting on the oversized role that Steve Bannon has in all of this. Bannon is a fascist if ever there was one, and he recognized back in 2015/2016 that he could control and manipulate trump to do his bidding, which has been to crush democracy around the world. Bannon is the one who terrifies me, because he’s evil and he’s smart.
Bannon is a huge activist of Trump because Bannon is a Trump TOOL! Trump loves tools because he is not too smart. He flatters all these white guys around him, doing the work and idea seeking for him! Trump NEVER takes the blame for anything but CREDIT for ALL! Watch the Steve Millers and Bannons and Stones and Jeff Clarks and Tucker Carsons and Hannitys. Plenty sitting around . . .
Absolutely. Trump future-pardoned Bannon for a future sentence from the federal government for the 'build the wall' scam. They had not been speaking at the time because Bannon had spoken negatively about T in his book. Suddenly, Bannon had ramped up his War Room with the Pillow Guy on several times per week blatherskiting about 'the election was stolen.' Bannon is Trump's boy. But: Trump has a puppet master.
I tend to think at this point Bannon is the "real Hitler" and Trump is cosplaying Ernst Roehm, the leader of the paramilitary Sturmabteilung (SA), who was purged by Hitler and killed in 1934..... Bannon knows how to manipulate Trump (apparently a low bar) and that makes him the more dangerous fanatic.....
His "interview" on The Circus was chilling. Tim Miller's face said it all. And Miller had a brilliant face-to-face with Kari Lake. Unfortunately not seen on the proverbial MSM.
Bannon may be 'the Hitler' but Trump has someone(s) who is giving him the orders - not sure it is Bannon. I think the Cambridge Analytica funders (that was Bannon's baby to use psychological operations to target our elections) are the puppet masters or among the puppet masters for Trump. Follow the money. Trump Jr. and Eric have stated publicly that they 'don't need to worry about loans because they can get money from Russia.'
Bruce, Agree. I've wondered about Bannon's 'get out of jail free card' with Trump's pardon of Bannon's indictment by the federal government for the 'build the wall scam.' Trump was furious with Bannon for speaking against him in his book - but suddenly Bannon was given a huge banana with a Get Out of Jail Free Card and he's in his War Room, spewing spy ops in the same vein he created Cambridge Analytica (he was VP).
Bannon and Rupert Murdoch are two of the same - anarchists who want to break down the current system because they think they will be running the next one..... Sadly, they have found many poorly educated and gullible people to give them room to do this.
It would be difficult to choose who is the 'worst.' But Bannon has the skills to message with psy ops warfare. Cambridge Analytica was more dangerous than anything Murdoch could print, and that was Bannon's baby (he was VP - but the creator). He had to resign because of the federal government's agreement made with the president of the firm to close it as a business. The parent company went bankrupt, and Bannon came back as Trump's chief strategist. He is at it again. Bannon concerns me more. I hate to tell you what the average American's reading level has dropped to: but they stay tuned to Bannon and ilk on his War Room. No reading required. We have our work cut out for us after Joe WINS!!! Back to basic reading and civic classes.
There has been a sea change in reading instruction, with a long-overdue shift to phonics for basic instruction, with alternate approaches for those who do not do well with phonics. But most students seem to do much better with phonics than the usual repetitive "see Spot run" type. Due to a school scheduling glitch when I was in kindergarten, I skipped first grade and had to be taught how to read at a first grade level in 10 weeks. The district used phonics as it was the only approach that could have worked, and today I have a house full of books, over a dozen books published and nearly 100 magazine articles published as well. Guess it worked.....
I ask those who want to continue trying Trump and attempting to beat him in next year’s election, what do you propose doing if he wins, whether or not he’s convicted of any of the crimes he’s been charged with? Given your current stance, the only logical answer is to cry “wait until 2028”. There may be no 2028 election, and meanwhile with another 4 years and Trump’s stated goals for a second term, life will be miserable for millions. Is there ever a point when a democracy must extra judicially lock up a dangerous, a deranged individual precisely because that individual is a threat to democracy itself? It feels really weird to be taking this position, but I’m at a loss to come up with another solution, especially with the ghosts of unchecked Hitlers and Mussolinis haunting my nightmares.
Sorry TC. There was no attempt in 1929. Georg Elser tried in 1939 (there were 13 or so that we know of before 1939, and 9 after up to 1944. Then because no-one else could do it right, he did it himself in his Führerbunker in 1945. There are some other reported attempts, but none were even close. So, assassination is a tricky thing, and may even add to his invulnerability myth.
Believe me, I'm having these thoughts, too. Why would we ever let him take power, even if he "wins." Can we, would we, should we commit an anti-democratic act to save democracy?
After 9-11 we enacted the Patriot Act which I thought applied to any terrorists. Now I find out its just foreign terrorist, not domestic. Why? Because domestic terrorists are American Citizens and have rights. I call BS. When you start professing getting rid of the US Constitution, you are NOT an American.
Joyce -We have concerns about what possibly could happen to individuals like you and your colleagues (both public and private) who speak the truth if Trump were to be elected president.
Those of us that have been using our names to call out the insipid clown, are on record for our stance to preserve our republic. I for one am proud of my often stated position in opposition to everything he ever even thought of much less did. Years from now when they are looking back at this time in our history, people will be digging through what we have said, and maybe it’s impact on the world they live in, that’s who I write for. I want my grandchildren’s grandchildren to be able to be proud of what we did, if we are ever to have a chance to speak through the ages now is the time. I am so proud to have all of you for company, we are on the right side of history, of that I have no doubt.
I am proud to know you Dick Montagne. We are in this together, with Joyce!! We must elect Biden. I'm not worried about Trump or his minions. They will implode. I'm thinking a petition with millions of signatures to the RNC. Petitions for ending the Viet Nam War gathered millions of signatures and turned the tide. Then in 1993 to 1994, millions of Americans signed petitions to pass the Dietary Supplement Health and Education Act of 1994 (DSHEA) (which kept health food stores open, allowed supplement manufacturers to continue operating). DSHEA took one year to gain millions of signatures. Both campaigns looked dismal at their beginnings. The only numbers of signatures surpassing those on the DSHEA petitions were to end the Viet Nam War. So petition the RNC to dump Trump? We can do it on-line.
And I a proud to be with us. And I'm not going down easy! We need those we have elected to do, do! (Is that even English) What are our elected officials doing?! Biden better be ready to put the law on our side.
Ivan, we are not a religious group. We will fight, and our armed forces will be with us. Even if Tuberveggie succeeds in decimating officer ranks. Trump, unlike Hitler is no veteran. And, I personally would hate to be up against an army with our capabilities.
a second thought Bruce: millions of Americans signed petitions to end the war in Viet Nam. A decade later, another campaign that was only surpassed in numbers of signors by the Viet Nam War petition, saw millions of Americans sign to pass the Dietary Supplement Health and Education Act of 1994 (DSHEA) (which kept health food stores open, allowed supplement manufacturers to continue operating). DSHEA took one year to gain millions of signatures. Both campaigns looked dismal at their beginnings. So petition the RNC to dump Trump?
I think it is. We did it back in the 90s for DSHEA because the FDA was going to put the health food stores out of business. Jim Beck, then-Solaray President, now deceased, led the charge. We went to all the health food stores, and they put out petitions on their counters. That was before we had such Internet capabilities, so it was all done by hand with hand signed petitions that were copied and sent to the Senate via Orrin Hatch‘s office, because he sponsored the DSHEA. With all of the public outcry, Orrin was able to get every Senator on board. Now we have the Internet and I would recommend getting Taylor Swift on board with her millions and millions of Swifties. It could start with sympathetic blogs, such as Joyce, Mary, Trump, etc.
I Bruce Klassen sign this petition to remove Donald Trump from consideration as the RNC presidential candidate because of his violation of the 14th Ammendment section 3 of the United States Constitution
Let me think about this. My nephew is friends with Gwyneth Paltrow and her family. Let me see if anyone knows Taylor Swift. I know Taylor is involved politically and passionate about getting rid of Trump. She speaks out at her concerts: you can google and watch short clips of her doing so. She is vocal about Trump’s fascist agenda.
I do, too. Censorship will no doubt be the norm as simple newspaper stories are redacted, TV and radio stations controlled by "the state," personal mail is opened at the post office before being delivered, and parades are no longer allowed. Reporters and regular citizens would be punished for having the courage to tell the truth. Many rights that we take for granted right now may also end up on the "chopping block."
As I read what you've said,I have seen the same things mentioned in several other sites I read from.I keep thinking the same question,how the hell is this legal,to openly plot the bringing down of the US government,and to allow this to apparently come to an eventual fruition?Somewhere earlier I read we are Sleepwalking toward Fascism.It certainly appears so.
Sometimes I am reminded of a scene in Terminator 2,when Sarah Connor dreamed she was at a fence around a park,screaming at people to run,and she was not heard,and then the bombs drop.Some days I swear I feel like we're collectively at that fence,screaming the danger to unhearing,unseeing and uncaring people,living in their bubble,and we know those bombs are right now coming.So how do we get through to them?And can we hope to stop those bombs(i.e.tfg and his henchmen)from destroying everything we have now?Voting is a very good start,for sure,but how do we make sure this cannot come back again to haunt us and here we are again,without the rules we need to outlaw this idea of overthrowing our government,yet again,and the next person/people succeed and it is even worse than it could be now?Should there not be clear guidelines put into law to keep these kinds of people away from any facet of our government?The laws that were put into place after the Civil War,are so vague as to be basically useless.We need stronger,more specific guidelines that get the job done quickly.And they are needed post haste.
The things I'm reading are frightening,and could become terrifying reality.We should all be concerned,and find ways to head this off,before it's too late to be able to do anything.The people plotting this are absolutely going to make sure of it.
Melissa, the people I cannot understand are the “third” party candidates. What the hell is Jill Stein, Robert Kennedy, or Cornell West thinking? Do they fail to recognize that Jill Stein’s efforts which might have been “honorable” in 2016 were helpful to Trump? Are these folks ignoring the rhetoric and plans being laid before us?
I disagree, Dianne, only because this is a federal trial, not a murder trial. Although, Trump is responsible for over 1 million deaths from Covid. There will be no shenanigans allowed by Judge Chutkin nor Jack Smith. Let’s not forget that Smith has prosecuted many world crimes out of Hague. Trump will have to sit through proven evidence and testimonies that are all about him. Watching him squirm will be my biggest fantasy.
Joyce, I respect you and your opinions strongly. I do agree though with your friend who feels they can't go through another round of Trump presidential talk and depressing rants and tantrums. Yes, I will vote for the good of our nation but I am taking myself out of the continuing awful Trump news. I know what he stands for and I don't need to be exposed to more. Hiding works for me also. Just wish I had a few chickens with me!
I'm not hiding, but I am certainly limiting my exposure drastically. Rather than listen to tfg or his ilk, I rely on people like Joyce, Jay Kuo, Heather Cox Richardson, Robert Hubbell, and Thom Hartmann, all of whom are on Substack, plus a couple of people on Facebook whom I have come to trust after following them for several years. I NEVER watch TV, and rarely read anything from the msm. (The NYT's original headline about tfg's speech in NH is a glaring example of why not.) I can remain well informed this way without subjecting myself to garbage.
My blood pressure is not as high as it was a year ago, when I watched MSNBC and CNN hours at time. To this day, I have never watched Faux TV, and have no intentions of doing so.
Nowadays, I prefer to watch old reruns of Andy Griffith Show, Father Knows Best, Bewitched, and I Dream of Jeannie. There was no mention of hate or revenge, and if there was anything said of a political nature, it was about local elections for town mayor.
When I moved in July, I cut the cable package down to the basic channels, eliminating CNN, MSNBC, et al. Now, I watch one soap opera a day, and that's it. It's mostly Substack for news and the NYT for puzzles and features.
Its so nice to know I am in good company. I too have TFG's number after living in NY all my life. My distractions have been getting caught up with Gordon Ramsay's shows. I love Masterchef and especially Masterchef Junior (these kids are amazing). I have also gone back to reading, actual books, not digital. Getting caught up on my Patricia Cornwell, Kay Scarpetta series. It has really helped my blood pressure. I know how I am voting next November.
I agree with you Dianne. I know enough about Trump and his cronies. Used to watch Deadline And msnbc every day. Now I spend relax time with the Waltons, Seinfeld, anything light. Lower blood pressure! In my heart I already know what and who this country needs and election day we can only pray the majority won't vote for the fat guy.
Actually by watching "comfort" shows we are protecting our brains (lowering our blood pressure). Being vigilant does not mean on high alert constantly but to continue to watch and then VOTE (like our life depends on it...because it does).
Love Perry Mason! Good friends recommended Lawrence Welk, yep Lawrence Welk! The leisure suits, the toupees, the Champagne Lady! It's a hoot and a time travel. Takes me back to watching it with my Grandma. Check your local PBS station for listings. You'll be glad you did!
To maintain a sense of involvement, I have moved from surfing the news to writing postcards to support Activate America. Being involved is important too.
I expect another case of carpal tunnel syndrome this coming year. It worked in 2020 and 2022, and will work again. Positive action is the balm that will get us through this!
I'm with you Sandy on limiting myself but I must admit, sometimes I get sucked into the Rabbit hole. I know what it does to me mentally and physically and I have to keep reminding myself to keep it to a minimum.
Susan, our reality is “we will go through another round of Trump candidate’ talk.” For me his presence on the stage is so ever present that we can not hide nor close our ears. I hear friends and family say they are turning away but the large screen TVs are everywhere, as in 1984.
We must take care of ourselves and those who we care deeply about. That might even include people who fail to recognize this moment.
I understand that John. I know and understand what Trump stands for and that will not change. I'm sure his antics will become worse. He will always be evil . Why listen to more of the same when I know I will never support him. Enough is enough. Just vote for thee good of our country and know it's definitely NOT Trump.
Susan, it's ok not to watch if you just can't. Save your energy for finding out what went down at the trial. We've got your back, my friend, we'll catch you up.
Joyce: Thank you for your courage in continuing to speak out and inform. I do not use the word “courage” lightly because the threat is real and you bravely continue to fight for our country.
I have concerns about what possibly could happen to individuals like Joyce and her colleagues (both public and private) who speak the truth if Trump were to be elected president.
trump has already signaled what will happen.
When will the “mainstream” media start spreading the word or are they too worried about Trump’s likely plans for free speech?
No Steve, trump has articulated what *will* happen should he find himself president again. He doesnt waffle. The “could happen” hinges on whether he finds himself president again. It isnt just Joyce or other outspoken people Conway, Tribe, Biden, Luttig etc, its anyone who has donated to AOC or Bernie or anyone not supporting trump, because no doubt hacking the servers of the liberal fundraising groups wont be difficult. Or anyone “liking” something anti trump on social media, and most likely, anyone in public who isnt obviously white. The Arab Americans who say they wont support Biden, are they so delusional that they think that the trumpMagapublican thugs wont round them up too? Or any conservative voting person of color, hello Lantino community and Cubans who vote for Republicans? Nope be prepared to be rounded up, deported, tortured, killed. Thats what is at stake.
Thank you, Tina ... Your post is obviously TRUE !
There were Jews who supported Hitler I am told.
Steve, you are right, but please be prepared.
Still chuckling at the, “And as an Irish American, I am 100% ready anyway.....
Fellow Irish American, and daughter, sister and widow of US military veterans here. Born ready, as my brothers would say.
And working hard to get out the vote. Let’s do this.
Upholding a democracy is not easy, it is messy business. We have history to show us how often we have had to struggle to achieve a modicum of the plan - the US Constitution.
Steve, you speak with authority, and experience I do not have. And my call is for Urgency.
As a former USAF enlistee, I second the words of Steve Flinn.
Thank you, Steve.
Yes, "could" is an operative word...BUT...The fact that he has stated what he "will" do must be considered in light of this man's (Trump's) behavior.
Yippee Steve!!
I needed to stop reading Ruth Ben-Ghiat (paused the membership) but there's a list that the koch bros. created. I don't remember what it's called but it's the crap out of hitler and mussolini. Ruth's name is on it. I'm sorry, I couldn't find it but I have in the past (it's on Ruth's Lucid and I managed to find it on the internet). When rump was put in the oval office, my spouse told me not to write anything that was bad about what was happening because it could be traced to me. That was seven years ago and it's too late :) . We type truth to lies.
Sherri, from speaking truth to power, “we type truth to lies” is fab. Our battle cry with “we’re in this together.”
Thom Hartmann gives us that horrid picture:
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid02hEXYAJhpJNFvVhGwt7icF3Qy657Yu6dLuieGkS78QGy9xoxjM7rwQjSoBmFrhRs4l&id=1447833839&mibextid=Nif5oz
https://m.facebook.com/story.php?story_fbid=pfbid02hEXYAJhpJNFvVhGwt7icF3Qy657Yu6dLuieGkS78QGy9xoxjM7rwQjSoBmFrhRs4l&id=1447833839&mibextid=Nif5oz
Thom Hartmann here describes being in prison with fellow writers like Heather Cox Richardson. Yes, "Joyce Vance" would be on that trump list, too. We have much work to do to save our democracy and our courageous writers.
Time to put it on the backs of the RNC. I hope everyone will be in touch with Ronna & her cabal & ssk if they support Trump's stated plans if not what are they going to do about it??
You are right Tim!! Every person appearing to support Trump should be asked that question. And pushed back on when they try to deflect with “I don’t comment on political candidate speeches” and “I didn’t see or hear his speech yet”. They are supporting him and that is the only way he keeps his power. If more and more Republicans had to answer for their support of his fascist rhetoric, maybe the tide would turn to more Republicans standing for democracy. And maybe the Trumpians would slowly come to see the light.
Great idea Tim!
Too late Tim
Bruce, I think it's too late as well. Saw this coming in dots for a couple decades. The dots are now connected. "Hope" is a useful too but I'm not sure I believe in it. We've all seen too much and I don't know how in the hell to turn this around. We'd have to deAll I can do is inform and that's all I'm doing.
Sorry, took a stroll through the internet (can't find the list - I"m sure it's in Ruth's "Lucid".
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/show/trumps-ramped-up-rhetoric-raises-new-concerns-about-violence-and-authoritarianism
Ruth Ben-Ghiat:
In all cases of history that I have studied in my book "Strongmen," people did not take the various Hitlers and Mussolinis seriously until it was too late.
I think I saw it in Chop Wood, Jessica Craven...Hope: I think God is too busy trying to inform the "C"ristians why He wanted a new covenant, to answer our prayers
Oh??? Educate me please. I'm always open to learning more!
Unless I am behind bars or lying in the gutters, it cannot be too late. The stakes are just that important for everyone, including those Rs and voters who don’t speak out.
Nice John, but how about ten days before you are hauled in? Then you can resist, and aren't just a lamb for the slaughter. Of course, "the meek shall inherit the Kingdom"...and those lambs did offer us their sacrifice as a warning...To not leave it fester too long before we act against the evil.
Hey, Valere! Good seeing ya! I intended to reply to your query about my name the other day but got sidetracked.
So...Wineaux...is not a surname. It’s actually a portmanteau from combining wine (or wino) + Bordeaux. 🍷
I’m a retired SW engineer, but I’m also a >wine educator<. So, there you have it! Oh, wait! I should prob say that since following Joyce, Andrew Weissmann, Neal Katyal, & so many brilliant, legal minds, I’m seeing myself also as an armchair law student or a 1L. 😉
Cheers! 🍷
I chuckled when I saw your chosen handle because a good friend of many years has used it for her email address handle. We were fellow students abroad in France, in the early 60s, and her choice certainly refers to her love of wine.
Hey, that’s very cool! I didn’t begin traveling to France until 2012, and completely fell in love. Brushed off and improved on my high school French, and thus made several trips since then ... mainly Paris, Reims, Versailles.
But, recently (April/May) spent about a month in Tours (Loire Valley) visiting a friend, & FINALLY got to Bordeaux. Got a chance to practice my limited French...I got better. 😬
Thank you Wineaux, I have a friend who is a wine educator as well:) I'm a teetotaler but since my friend is a wine educator, your name caught me. I'm also a Joyce Vance 101 student.
Rachel Maddow said exactly that...The RNC is the only entity that can put a stop to Trump now. Every day they keep endorsing him sets the country back further and further and will allow him to damage our democracy further. This mess is totally the Republican Parties doing and we need to vote them out of office ASAP.
Rona has no power She’s relegated to being a useful idiot. She will become un useful as soon as trump is elected
McDaniel has already said she will not comment. Going to be an awkward Thanksgiving at the Romney house.
I eagerly await the day a reporter replies to McDaniel's kind of evasion with, "DT lies and threatens American democracy. How do you live with yourself?"
(I am well aware that it will not happen.)
McDaniels will PASS!
They don’t think it’s their job.
Well, first off I await that kind of reporter's reply to any number of statements by GOP members discussing DT, not just RNC management. This is just one example. Secondly, McDaniel's claim that it's not her job is a bs denial of her responsibility to support candidates who're not dangers to the Republic, her "job" be damned much less what she thinks her job might be.
As I wrote, I'm not holding my breath waiting to hear this has happened.
Isn't a no comment as good as saying: This guy is nuts but I'm a chicken shit & I'm afraid of Trump??? Sometimes a no answer us as powerful as word salad!
She said this with a twisted little smile on her face. I must say, I cannot stand her.
Ronna wants to keep her job! However, Trump has her number! She will be replaced and perhaps deleted entirely in months ahead. Trump knows McDaniels is wobbling in support of him. She dropped Romney from her name years ago even if it helped her get the GOP/RNC job! Do you have any room at your Thanksgiving table?
I suspect they (uncle and niece) no longer are in the same room together.
Agree, Maryanne.
Oh, the RNC is fully behind him. They are not going to be any help. Right thinking Republicans (if there are any left) simply need to break with their former party which has become unrecognizable. And they need to go public with it.
The RNC doesn't matter. They have no influence on DJT or his fanatical supporters. They also know that to say anything negative about "the chosen one" is a completely useless and self-destructive move.
25 years ago if you told me DJT would become president I would have laughed and maybe thought u were crazy or just really dumb. Today I’m dumbstruck scared for democracy. I also feel like I’m ready to pass 1st year law school classes from reading Joyce Vance’s daily Substack!
I think most people who lived and/or grew up in New York wouldn’t have imagined that Trump would be president. He showed his colors early on and for the most part, was not liked. I think that “leak” from Jenna Ellis is telling but not surprising. He wants to be king, to rule forever. The sooner we rid ourselves of this lunatic, the better we will be. We have a difficult situation in that Biden will run again and so many people who voted for him the first time, may not vote for him again. Add to that a third party and we have a troubling situation. We ALL must vote, but in addition, we must do all we can to get citizens to vote and not pass up this incredibly important election. Biden has been the best president in my lifetime and I would vote for him again. I’m overseas with my family for the next month, but when I get back home I will be very proactive again with Vote.org. No matter what happens in the next election, Trump will say he won so we’d better be prepared and not allow him to win.
My concern with peoples' caviling about Biden's age is that anyone can have a health issue at almost any age. Is it more likely with someone 81 years old? Hack yes, I'm 82 and growing old is not for sissies. But people in good health die at much younger ages from all sorts of causes, like stepping in front of the the No. 10 bus from Dubuque..... The thing is that right now the world has decided to come unglued all over the place, and there is no one else currently in the Democratic Party with the foreign policy experience and personal contacts and relationships Joe Biden has. It is a resource that may keep some of these eruptions from detonating into major conflicts. There are several talented younger Democratic future candidates, but in 2024 I'll stick with the geezer who also has the finest medical care available to him as POTUS..... And does anyone REALLY believe that Donald Trump is in better condition at 77? Joe Manchin at 76? When I look at what Biden has been able to do with a hostile opposition and a razor-thin majority in the Senate, I ask myself, "Where do we get such men.....?"
He seems to be in pretty good health. And right, any age can suffer ill health Fetterman being a prime model. (A soap box comment: stop eating animal products they cause all the diseases and stroke and heart issues), anyway, no on who isnt sexist or racist should have a problem with the Biden-Harris ticket because if he has a health issue we have Kamala. Again any Democrat whining about his age is likely sexist or racist. It is an entire administration, her values are his values at this level, they have an amazing group of people working together with the goal to assist the American people to have a better existence. Thats all anyone needs to vote on regarding Biden.
When people want to talk about Biden’s age, vitality and health as opposed to trump’s, I advise them to picture trump on a bicycle. And I’m not even considering the fact that he would refuse to wear a helmet because it would mess up his “perfect” hair.
Age and infrastructure building vs Delusional malignant narcissist fascist? I’m taking age every time! I’m taking Biden every round. It’s not close.
Betsy, Trump looks like he is wearing a girdle or complete set of spanx beneath his suits when he goes to court - from the golf course where he looks grossly obese. He truly is in terrible shape.
Maybe it’s for squishing in his diaper so it’s not so obvious.
I bet Biden outlives the Mango Monster. Obesity is not a good trait for living to a ripe old age.
Bruce, well said and from your heart! We need millions more like you to give Biden the credit due with their VOTE! Thanks for putting it out there.
Bruce, My thoughts exactly. I am with 100% on this.
Thank you Bruce, for distilling this argument so concisely. I just shared your words with a friend who is working on convincing her friends who are Republicans, hate trump, but think Biden is "too old".
100% Bruce. Biden is incredibly effective.
Reminds me of what was said regarding ever electing Ronald Reagan.
Thank you, I don't understand how 5 US Code 7311 isn't enforced, it would seem to apply as he's crossed the threshold for advocating the overthrow of our Constitutional form of government at least two times now.
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/5/7311
Thank you Shire & the Cornell Law school for text of 5 USC 7311 & all its subsections:
Section (1 ) tfg has made an express oral & written admission of killing our democracy ✔️
Section (2) tfg leads what's left of R's who are advocating fascism ✔️
Section (3) we will see this coming Friday if 'no budget' and/or choked funding amounts to a "strike" led by an advocate of state religion. & its Pharisee cult Leader. ✔️
Thank you Bryan, I appreciate the validation, now to figure out who should be enforcing as it specifically states "illegal" and yet...
I need to research the the fascist admissions' possible impact on Colorado's pending Court decision on barring tfg from the Colorado 2024 Presidential Election ballot as well as Jack Smith's use of the Defendant's seditious admissions in the J6 case.
Well done, Counselor.
With the Budget, deal Subsection (3) is now moot.
Could this develop into an outcome of the Courts' willingness to let him ramble "on the record"? As a novice observer to the legal procedures, I live in hope that Jack Smith et.al. will fold this into the proceedings.
Judge Engoron has let the Defendant 'ramble' or rant but, has obtained evidence from Fraudster & Sons direct knowledge of the fraudulent "terms" & "deals". The Judge is the trier of admissible facts. There is no jury.
Trump didn’t hear when his advisors told him he lost
He said he won the election no matter what the cost
Lied cajoled & cheated as his lawyers manned the phones ( they’ll be disbarred)
Soon he’ll have something in common with Mr Al
Capone
His followers cannot bear to see the light
They claim he won when we know that’ ain’t right
It is comical but sad to hear their crazy talk
That they believe this grifter with whatever lies he hawks
Trump forewarns us what he plans to do
And with democracy and separation of powers
He has big plans to screw
But we will vote again until he’s out of sight
And Trump will lose again we’ve just begun to fight!!!
HOPE you are correct.
To listen and to hear are two different things! Trump was told by ALL around him and never listened because Trump did not want to admit his failing! Pathetic beast who is dragging down our wonderful Nation! Kick him to the curb! VOTE! Or get what you deserve!
I do not know how Trump is still alive — diet alone should have gotten him by now. And don’t we have any snipers in our special forces? He should receive the same treatment he has been threatening so many with — isn’t OUR constitutional duty to protect our democracy from him and his cronies?
Nope but nice poetry.
Lied cajoled and cheated as his lawyers manned the phone, he
Soon'l have something in common with Mr. Al Capone-e
(rhymes better, but where to add "they'll be disbarred"?)
A stupendous irony rarely mentioned is that if the alt-right gets the authoritarian government they want, it will within three years take away their precious guns. With all the "vermin" in camps, the new Freedom Republic of America will declare no further need of an armed citizenry. Those who object will join the vermin.
What these idiots don't realize is that it's the *liberals* who are safeguarding such rights.
A Trump administration would eliminate the Bill of Rights.
I am frightened.
It’s not Trump himself who frightens me, although he can certainly whip a crowd into a frenzy of murderous and mindless destruction.
Rather, I am concerned there is another person who is much more intelligent, more disciplined, and more capable of directing the masses toward toward the annihilation of our democracy. Consider that there is new Hitler somewhere in our midst. If someone as talentless and dumb as Trump can cause this much damage, think of the destruction someone with brains and evil intent could do.
Be wary. Consider how we as a society can prevent this from happening.
I think Project 2025 is not just there for trump; it's available to whichever fascist wants it.
Yes. It’s my opinion that McConnell and Ryan and others before Trump were already working toward a quiet overthrow. They also wanted permanent one-party control but veiled in “democracy”. Trump stumbled onto the fertile soil they had been cultivating and took full advantage. But he doesn’t do subtlety. One party control is ok but one man control is better -- and only one man in particular. Institutional violence is ok but physical violence is better, being on the jackboots.
Kathy, this is my fear as well.
“Bring on the jackboots.” Sigh!
Hi Kathy, just a time-saving tip - go to the three dots, at the bottom, right side of your post. Poke on that and select 'edit' - then you can edit the post such as changing to 'bring'
Valere
💙
I believe that if somehow trump is _not_ the R nominee, whoever it is will use the same playbook. They may not entirely be OK with it, but they will be told that they will lose R support if they don't follow it. That is why we _must_ elect Biden, no matter what.
Agreed
Bannon and
Stephen Miller come to mind.
Keep your eye on Elon Musk! Cannot run for office since born in South Africa but is an American citizen. He is a clever sleuth and ultra ambitious for himself. Musk travels “underground” and has been highly successful obtaining U.S. grants to further himself. Furthermore, he is anti democracy and anti Constitution. A loner in our lands and society.
Musk’s ambition is over whelming his life.
Musk is a fake genius.
Nancy, you nailed it.
A doc, think President Mike Johnson.
The players are being put into position.
How disappointed they'll be when donald loses! I hope that he does win the primary-- it will shock the whole country and wake up all the lapsed and indifferent voters.
Swallowing hard.
Hi Gus, did you mean 'does not win the primary' ?
Hi Valere, no I did mean win the primary, for its shock value.
But thinking about it, I was wrong! More problems for the courts and prosecutions, among many reasons he should not win the primary..
I didn't think that one through. I am so frustrated. I'm glad you caught it and was so polite about bringing it to my attention.
Thanks!
💙 We are in this together!! And the primary will be what it is:)) It would be wonderful to see him booted from the primaries - but he will not be president.
His name is Steve Bannon.
Multiple your “deeply troubled” feelings times 10, and that’s where you’ll find me. I’m over here in the Terrified Aisle at the grocery store.
Kimberly,
I think I spotted you there.
As a senior citizen, I'm just as worried, but I'm too worried about my grandchildren. They're in school, so they may not even learn about Hitler, Stalin, or even Putin if history books become "extinct," or especially if history or social studies classes are no longer taught.
Jen Psaki was dynamite. The issues we face are clear. We must do all we can to dissuade any and all people we know the danger of backing a third party or independent candidate. Forwarding Joyce's, Rick Wilson's TCinLA, Robert Hubble and Heather's Substacks to all we know who my be unconcerned, wobbling or ignorant must be done also.
Jay Kuo as well.
It's true that a certain percentage of this country are going to be "Always Trumpers" despite any facts that come to light pertaining to his plans, his behavior, his culpability, or his open disdain of all the "American" values he professes to embrace. If he were to die of natural causes tomorrow, they would blame someone, find a plot, and turn him into a martyr. At this point, I consider it the duty of every eligible voter who dislikes Trump to vote against him should he become the nominee, and to vote against every would-be mini Trump who espouses the same poisonous and dangerous rhetoric and policies. I too am exhausted by the spite, vindictiveness, petty jealousy, insatiable need for attention, proud ignorance, and boasting of the man who wants to destroy everything that doesn't reflect a flattering portrait of himself.
But I tell myself that all it (should)! take to defeat him is to remember that the 30% of "Trump voters" don't reflect the desires of the majority, and that if the majority rejects Trumpism and turns out to vote against him, we just might start on the road to better times.
And the hate within his followers wont abate. From here on out for years, democracy loving Americans will need to be on guard, for the likes of trumps enablers and the far right maga christofascists will continue to find weak places to get in and try their hand at gaining power
Majorities don't matter to fascists, WW.
Joyce,
That was a tough one to read and even rougher to write. I have been very worried of late about this wind of hate that is brewing in the country. It is even more distressing when one knows they are in with the "vermin", You certainly are, as am I. We have got to get involved in our democracy to end this threat with the vote. If it is contested it will mean blood in the streets, which is what the Nationalist militias want. The far right is on the wrong side of history, but they are so militant about being right. Time to sleep but not restfully...
Stay strong. We're in this together.
Steve
When I saw trump’s Veteran’s Day screed, immediately had two thoughts. First, his “message” to veterans felt eerily and terrifyingly like the “stand down and stand by” one to the proud boys in 2020 -- an appeal for the current and former military to be his storm troopers. Second, I wondered why the media is not reporting on the oversized role that Steve Bannon has in all of this. Bannon is a fascist if ever there was one, and he recognized back in 2015/2016 that he could control and manipulate trump to do his bidding, which has been to crush democracy around the world. Bannon is the one who terrifies me, because he’s evil and he’s smart.
Well, Bannon is looking at prison time, and I wish they'd get on with it. What a cancer.
Bannon is a huge activist of Trump because Bannon is a Trump TOOL! Trump loves tools because he is not too smart. He flatters all these white guys around him, doing the work and idea seeking for him! Trump NEVER takes the blame for anything but CREDIT for ALL! Watch the Steve Millers and Bannons and Stones and Jeff Clarks and Tucker Carsons and Hannitys. Plenty sitting around . . .
I think it is that T. is Bannon's (and Stephen Miller's) tool.
Absolutely. Trump future-pardoned Bannon for a future sentence from the federal government for the 'build the wall' scam. They had not been speaking at the time because Bannon had spoken negatively about T in his book. Suddenly, Bannon had ramped up his War Room with the Pillow Guy on several times per week blatherskiting about 'the election was stolen.' Bannon is Trump's boy. But: Trump has a puppet master.
Maybe it’s time to think about Git-mo. Must have kept it alive for some reason!
I tend to think at this point Bannon is the "real Hitler" and Trump is cosplaying Ernst Roehm, the leader of the paramilitary Sturmabteilung (SA), who was purged by Hitler and killed in 1934..... Bannon knows how to manipulate Trump (apparently a low bar) and that makes him the more dangerous fanatic.....
His "interview" on The Circus was chilling. Tim Miller's face said it all. And Miller had a brilliant face-to-face with Kari Lake. Unfortunately not seen on the proverbial MSM.
Maybe YouTube? Look around.
Where did you see that?
"The Circus" final episode on Showtime.
My impression to the T, Bruce.
Bannon may be 'the Hitler' but Trump has someone(s) who is giving him the orders - not sure it is Bannon. I think the Cambridge Analytica funders (that was Bannon's baby to use psychological operations to target our elections) are the puppet masters or among the puppet masters for Trump. Follow the money. Trump Jr. and Eric have stated publicly that they 'don't need to worry about loans because they can get money from Russia.'
Bruce, Agree. I've wondered about Bannon's 'get out of jail free card' with Trump's pardon of Bannon's indictment by the federal government for the 'build the wall scam.' Trump was furious with Bannon for speaking against him in his book - but suddenly Bannon was given a huge banana with a Get Out of Jail Free Card and he's in his War Room, spewing spy ops in the same vein he created Cambridge Analytica (he was VP).
Bannon and Rupert Murdoch are two of the same - anarchists who want to break down the current system because they think they will be running the next one..... Sadly, they have found many poorly educated and gullible people to give them room to do this.
It would be difficult to choose who is the 'worst.' But Bannon has the skills to message with psy ops warfare. Cambridge Analytica was more dangerous than anything Murdoch could print, and that was Bannon's baby (he was VP - but the creator). He had to resign because of the federal government's agreement made with the president of the firm to close it as a business. The parent company went bankrupt, and Bannon came back as Trump's chief strategist. He is at it again. Bannon concerns me more. I hate to tell you what the average American's reading level has dropped to: but they stay tuned to Bannon and ilk on his War Room. No reading required. We have our work cut out for us after Joe WINS!!! Back to basic reading and civic classes.
There has been a sea change in reading instruction, with a long-overdue shift to phonics for basic instruction, with alternate approaches for those who do not do well with phonics. But most students seem to do much better with phonics than the usual repetitive "see Spot run" type. Due to a school scheduling glitch when I was in kindergarten, I skipped first grade and had to be taught how to read at a first grade level in 10 weeks. The district used phonics as it was the only approach that could have worked, and today I have a house full of books, over a dozen books published and nearly 100 magazine articles published as well. Guess it worked.....
Bannon is one of all too many that terrifies. But that “terrifying” behavior and rhetoric is exactly their modus operandi.
We are in this together.
And in serving in trump's administration, Bannon was privy to our most dangerous secrets!
Don't forget that Bannon was being funded by the Mercer family. The billionaires are actually the ones behind all of this.
Brewing? It is Brewed and people are drinking it.
The Cool Aid of the domestic terrorists?
I ask those who want to continue trying Trump and attempting to beat him in next year’s election, what do you propose doing if he wins, whether or not he’s convicted of any of the crimes he’s been charged with? Given your current stance, the only logical answer is to cry “wait until 2028”. There may be no 2028 election, and meanwhile with another 4 years and Trump’s stated goals for a second term, life will be miserable for millions. Is there ever a point when a democracy must extra judicially lock up a dangerous, a deranged individual precisely because that individual is a threat to democracy itself? It feels really weird to be taking this position, but I’m at a loss to come up with another solution, especially with the ghosts of unchecked Hitlers and Mussolinis haunting my nightmares.
I keep thinking of the guy who tried to assassinate Hitler in 1929.
Sorry TC. There was no attempt in 1929. Georg Elser tried in 1939 (there were 13 or so that we know of before 1939, and 9 after up to 1944. Then because no-one else could do it right, he did it himself in his Führerbunker in 1945. There are some other reported attempts, but none were even close. So, assassination is a tricky thing, and may even add to his invulnerability myth.
I meant 39 - 29 was a typo. You're right about the assassination record. If Trump does win next year....
Believe me, I'm having these thoughts, too. Why would we ever let him take power, even if he "wins." Can we, would we, should we commit an anti-democratic act to save democracy?
After 9-11 we enacted the Patriot Act which I thought applied to any terrorists. Now I find out its just foreign terrorist, not domestic. Why? Because domestic terrorists are American Citizens and have rights. I call BS. When you start professing getting rid of the US Constitution, you are NOT an American.
We do what we have to do.
Joyce -We have concerns about what possibly could happen to individuals like you and your colleagues (both public and private) who speak the truth if Trump were to be elected president.
Ivan, We will go with her. We are in this together.
Those of us that have been using our names to call out the insipid clown, are on record for our stance to preserve our republic. I for one am proud of my often stated position in opposition to everything he ever even thought of much less did. Years from now when they are looking back at this time in our history, people will be digging through what we have said, and maybe it’s impact on the world they live in, that’s who I write for. I want my grandchildren’s grandchildren to be able to be proud of what we did, if we are ever to have a chance to speak through the ages now is the time. I am so proud to have all of you for company, we are on the right side of history, of that I have no doubt.
I am proud to know you Dick Montagne. We are in this together, with Joyce!! We must elect Biden. I'm not worried about Trump or his minions. They will implode. I'm thinking a petition with millions of signatures to the RNC. Petitions for ending the Viet Nam War gathered millions of signatures and turned the tide. Then in 1993 to 1994, millions of Americans signed petitions to pass the Dietary Supplement Health and Education Act of 1994 (DSHEA) (which kept health food stores open, allowed supplement manufacturers to continue operating). DSHEA took one year to gain millions of signatures. Both campaigns looked dismal at their beginnings. The only numbers of signatures surpassing those on the DSHEA petitions were to end the Viet Nam War. So petition the RNC to dump Trump? We can do it on-line.
And I a proud to be with us. And I'm not going down easy! We need those we have elected to do, do! (Is that even English) What are our elected officials doing?! Biden better be ready to put the law on our side.
I agree Dick and also proud to know you and those here who see things as we do.
Add law school/college professors to the lot. Academia is usually one of the first to go. Trust me. They are already purging.
Evidenced in Florida.
True...and others that are not as publicized.
New College, for example, in Florida!
Ivan, we are not a religious group. We will fight, and our armed forces will be with us. Even if Tuberveggie succeeds in decimating officer ranks. Trump, unlike Hitler is no veteran. And, I personally would hate to be up against an army with our capabilities.
a second thought Bruce: millions of Americans signed petitions to end the war in Viet Nam. A decade later, another campaign that was only surpassed in numbers of signors by the Viet Nam War petition, saw millions of Americans sign to pass the Dietary Supplement Health and Education Act of 1994 (DSHEA) (which kept health food stores open, allowed supplement manufacturers to continue operating). DSHEA took one year to gain millions of signatures. Both campaigns looked dismal at their beginnings. So petition the RNC to dump Trump?
I like that. What did it take to manage that? Is such a campaign realistic given the 70 million or so on the other side?
I think it is. We did it back in the 90s for DSHEA because the FDA was going to put the health food stores out of business. Jim Beck, then-Solaray President, now deceased, led the charge. We went to all the health food stores, and they put out petitions on their counters. That was before we had such Internet capabilities, so it was all done by hand with hand signed petitions that were copied and sent to the Senate via Orrin Hatch‘s office, because he sponsored the DSHEA. With all of the public outcry, Orrin was able to get every Senator on board. Now we have the Internet and I would recommend getting Taylor Swift on board with her millions and millions of Swifties. It could start with sympathetic blogs, such as Joyce, Mary, Trump, etc.
I Bruce Klassen sign this petition to remove Donald Trump from consideration as the RNC presidential candidate because of his violation of the 14th Ammendment section 3 of the United States Constitution
First signature?
So, Valere. Do you know how to contact Taylor Swift, so that she gets the request. Because I sure don't. And how do we package it?
Hi Bruce,
Let me think about this. My nephew is friends with Gwyneth Paltrow and her family. Let me see if anyone knows Taylor Swift. I know Taylor is involved politically and passionate about getting rid of Trump. She speaks out at her concerts: you can google and watch short clips of her doing so. She is vocal about Trump’s fascist agenda.
!! YES !!
We are 'typing truth to power.'
I do, too. Censorship will no doubt be the norm as simple newspaper stories are redacted, TV and radio stations controlled by "the state," personal mail is opened at the post office before being delivered, and parades are no longer allowed. Reporters and regular citizens would be punished for having the courage to tell the truth. Many rights that we take for granted right now may also end up on the "chopping block."
God help us.
I agree totally !
Thank You
Dianne, God is too busy explaining to the Christian Fascists his reasons for wanting a New Covenant. We are on our own. We must exercise our choices.
As I read what you've said,I have seen the same things mentioned in several other sites I read from.I keep thinking the same question,how the hell is this legal,to openly plot the bringing down of the US government,and to allow this to apparently come to an eventual fruition?Somewhere earlier I read we are Sleepwalking toward Fascism.It certainly appears so.
Sometimes I am reminded of a scene in Terminator 2,when Sarah Connor dreamed she was at a fence around a park,screaming at people to run,and she was not heard,and then the bombs drop.Some days I swear I feel like we're collectively at that fence,screaming the danger to unhearing,unseeing and uncaring people,living in their bubble,and we know those bombs are right now coming.So how do we get through to them?And can we hope to stop those bombs(i.e.tfg and his henchmen)from destroying everything we have now?Voting is a very good start,for sure,but how do we make sure this cannot come back again to haunt us and here we are again,without the rules we need to outlaw this idea of overthrowing our government,yet again,and the next person/people succeed and it is even worse than it could be now?Should there not be clear guidelines put into law to keep these kinds of people away from any facet of our government?The laws that were put into place after the Civil War,are so vague as to be basically useless.We need stronger,more specific guidelines that get the job done quickly.And they are needed post haste.
The things I'm reading are frightening,and could become terrifying reality.We should all be concerned,and find ways to head this off,before it's too late to be able to do anything.The people plotting this are absolutely going to make sure of it.
Melissa, the people I cannot understand are the “third” party candidates. What the hell is Jill Stein, Robert Kennedy, or Cornell West thinking? Do they fail to recognize that Jill Stein’s efforts which might have been “honorable” in 2016 were helpful to Trump? Are these folks ignoring the rhetoric and plans being laid before us?
Narcissits
Yes, Margaret. I believe you are right.
Right, Cornell especially, I mean c’mon Man, yr supposed to be intelligent! Nope.
Yes. But they do not care.
Be afraid.
Be very afraid.
Then act!
My comment on a televised Trump trial: OJ Simpson. Don’t do it!
If any of his are televised, it will be nothing but a circus, and I don't mean that in a fun way.
I disagree, Dianne, only because this is a federal trial, not a murder trial. Although, Trump is responsible for over 1 million deaths from Covid. There will be no shenanigans allowed by Judge Chutkin nor Jack Smith. Let’s not forget that Smith has prosecuted many world crimes out of Hague. Trump will have to sit through proven evidence and testimonies that are all about him. Watching him squirm will be my biggest fantasy.
I know it's important, but I won't be watching.
It will be very uncomfortable to watch. But watch we must.
Joyce, I respect you and your opinions strongly. I do agree though with your friend who feels they can't go through another round of Trump presidential talk and depressing rants and tantrums. Yes, I will vote for the good of our nation but I am taking myself out of the continuing awful Trump news. I know what he stands for and I don't need to be exposed to more. Hiding works for me also. Just wish I had a few chickens with me!
I'm not hiding, but I am certainly limiting my exposure drastically. Rather than listen to tfg or his ilk, I rely on people like Joyce, Jay Kuo, Heather Cox Richardson, Robert Hubbell, and Thom Hartmann, all of whom are on Substack, plus a couple of people on Facebook whom I have come to trust after following them for several years. I NEVER watch TV, and rarely read anything from the msm. (The NYT's original headline about tfg's speech in NH is a glaring example of why not.) I can remain well informed this way without subjecting myself to garbage.
My blood pressure is not as high as it was a year ago, when I watched MSNBC and CNN hours at time. To this day, I have never watched Faux TV, and have no intentions of doing so.
Nowadays, I prefer to watch old reruns of Andy Griffith Show, Father Knows Best, Bewitched, and I Dream of Jeannie. There was no mention of hate or revenge, and if there was anything said of a political nature, it was about local elections for town mayor.
When I moved in July, I cut the cable package down to the basic channels, eliminating CNN, MSNBC, et al. Now, I watch one soap opera a day, and that's it. It's mostly Substack for news and the NYT for puzzles and features.
Its so nice to know I am in good company. I too have TFG's number after living in NY all my life. My distractions have been getting caught up with Gordon Ramsay's shows. I love Masterchef and especially Masterchef Junior (these kids are amazing). I have also gone back to reading, actual books, not digital. Getting caught up on my Patricia Cornwell, Kay Scarpetta series. It has really helped my blood pressure. I know how I am voting next November.
I agree with you Dianne. I know enough about Trump and his cronies. Used to watch Deadline And msnbc every day. Now I spend relax time with the Waltons, Seinfeld, anything light. Lower blood pressure! In my heart I already know what and who this country needs and election day we can only pray the majority won't vote for the fat guy.
Actually by watching "comfort" shows we are protecting our brains (lowering our blood pressure). Being vigilant does not mean on high alert constantly but to continue to watch and then VOTE (like our life depends on it...because it does).
I agree. I've been watching a lot of Perry Mason episodes lately, and imagining him having Trump on the stand.
Love Perry Mason! Good friends recommended Lawrence Welk, yep Lawrence Welk! The leisure suits, the toupees, the Champagne Lady! It's a hoot and a time travel. Takes me back to watching it with my Grandma. Check your local PBS station for listings. You'll be glad you did!
Thank you... have a good day. Yes, we're in this together.
To maintain a sense of involvement, I have moved from surfing the news to writing postcards to support Activate America. Being involved is important too.
I expect another case of carpal tunnel syndrome this coming year. It worked in 2020 and 2022, and will work again. Positive action is the balm that will get us through this!
Yes, Ma'am!!! Postcards!
I'm with you Sandy on limiting myself but I must admit, sometimes I get sucked into the Rabbit hole. I know what it does to me mentally and physically and I have to keep reminding myself to keep it to a minimum.
Susan, our reality is “we will go through another round of Trump candidate’ talk.” For me his presence on the stage is so ever present that we can not hide nor close our ears. I hear friends and family say they are turning away but the large screen TVs are everywhere, as in 1984.
We must take care of ourselves and those who we care deeply about. That might even include people who fail to recognize this moment.
I understand that John. I know and understand what Trump stands for and that will not change. I'm sure his antics will become worse. He will always be evil . Why listen to more of the same when I know I will never support him. Enough is enough. Just vote for thee good of our country and know it's definitely NOT Trump.
Susan, it's ok not to watch if you just can't. Save your energy for finding out what went down at the trial. We've got your back, my friend, we'll catch you up.