Trump's cronies will whine whether he loses the election OR is removed from the ballot. So remove him. What's the point of having the 14th amendment if it isn't going to be enforced as it so urgently needs to be right now? What's the point of having laws at all then? He needs to be removed from the ballot, and so does every other Congressional Rep or other public official who helped him. Because that's the law.
I say this often. If the amendment isn’t enforced, get rid of it. Every republican insurrectionist who signed the Paxton brief and the exprez all broke their oaths to uphold our Constitution. They have no business being in Congress. That Mike Johnson who slithered around and was instrumental in the attempted coup is now Speaker is just insane.
We should recognize that the 14th Amendment does not explicitly require keeping Trump off the ballot. Colorado and Maine have excluded him, because state law requires that those on the ballot be eligible. There may be states that allow ineligible candidates to be on the ballot—so much the worse for their voters. If the Supreme Court rules Trump ineligible, as it should, we shall then face the question of whether he may still appear in some states. Frankly, my political side would relish such a situation and the utter chaos it would cause for the Republican Party.
I think this is a great observation. I wonder what other states require that a candidate must be eligible to run. As I understand it, the SC can make a general ruling based on the facts in one case --am I right all you lawyers out there?. So couldn't the SC rule that candidates must be eligible to run for President to be put on the ballot in all States? And that the Colorado case proves that Trump was responsible for an insurrection. So let the R's complain. They are going to complain and possibly worse when he is soundly beat at the ballot box in the fall anyway. And we might be back in the same situation again.
States control elections, except to the extent that Congress uses its power to set conditions. As far as I know, Congress has not provided that a candidate need be eligible to be on the ballot. I have been told by other commenters on the 'net that some states allowed people too young to serve to be third-party candidates. So I don't think that the Supremes could order that only eligible people be on the ballot. Congress probably could, but that's not going to happen this year. The need to know that is one reason I expect the Supreme Court to take the Colorado case straight away, and to hear argument and decided it in an accelerated manner. But I have no particular expertise.
Well said, and I'm wondering if the Orange Gobshite will top his Xmas "goodwill toward all" message by a New Year's rant to exceed all rants...folks, we're watching real-time streaming of a man losing what remaining purchase he has on his sanity, a remarkable body of work that will provide material for hundreds - nay, thousands - of PhD theses in the years to come.
Enjoy the show, you'll never see anything like this in your lifetime.
I predict a psychotic break when he is defeated again. Why the man has not been declared mentally incompetent making him unfit to serve is beyond me. The alternate universe he exists in belongs in a mental hospital where people will be paid to agree with his rantings and he never leaves the walls of the institution. God help America.
I imagine that. He has gotten good at it. The man can talk and rant and gish gallop. Biden, BTW, cannot. Neither could Hillary. It matters not the falsehoods so much, as the presentation. The MAGGOT base would be creaming their jeans with every bomb that Trump throws. We can only hope that Biden's record remains strong and gets stronger without any meaningful October surprises. That will keep Trump's distortions and lies as transparent and obvious as possible.
I bet if you were around the man-child you’d find he says basically the same thing with the same little words. All. The. Time. Never anything new just the same old thing.
I really do want to see him on a debate stage. If he gets that fair.
I was thinking a commentor was right, thst he could get elected, but couldn’t serve. Wouldn’t that be bizarre?
Lance, Some of us have been waiting for the moment of narcissistic implosion. Perhaps Trump is having a rolling event: there was the food plate event that Cassidy Hutchinson testified to with ketchup running down the wall of the executive dining room when he had a fit over Bill Barr saying Trump was full of lies about winning the election - and this was before January 6 or the indictments. He forgot he raped E. Jean Carroll and sued her for defamation when she said he had raped her (following the May trial in which he was found guilty for sexual assault, and then Judge Kaplan explained to him that 'you raped her.' But he also forgot that he ran against Biden in 2020 and claimed he ran against Obama; he posted a recent social media diatribe in which he blasted the 'Afghanistan surrender' (I believe he arranged this under the Doha agreement); and in the same post told world leaders and All Ellectric Car Lunacy' and deranged Jack Smith to rot in hell....(Merry Christmas?). Some of this may be fatigue - memory loss - but given that he is on his second gag order, perhaps a bit of implosion is in play. I hope there will be PhD dissertations - but going back to the founders with complete and definitive biographies on all. We have wonderful biographies on major writers but not an entire set of biographies for all founders with collections of personal letters, diaries, and session notes. Until we have this kind of work, we won't have a triangulated view of 'what the Founders really meant' when they wrote the Constitution - because while there were primary writers, there were many supporting and contradicting views, including disagreements and compromises. Then we can really compare what this unhinged past president has done to us.
Trump isn't crazy. We have to stop mitigating his actions by saying he's simply non compos mentis. He has managed to manipulate people, and the press, for decades, which is not something a crazy person could possibly do. He will not "implode" either. Trump is too feral for that,
And who the hell cares what the Founding Fathers meant? It's 2024, not the 1700's. Any Constitution stands to be reinterpreted in accordance with the times, no?
I did not say Trump was ‘crazy.’ That’s too simplistic of a term to describe his psychological condition. And I am not mitigating his actions. You may wish to watch ‘Unfit,’ a movie from 2020 in which former Trump staffers and others who had known him over time and observed him on many occasions, described his behavior as erratic, and used terms such as ‘unhinged’ (George Conway) and pathologically mentally unfit (John Kelly). Other interviewees in the movie included clinical psychologists, a practicing psychiatrist as well as a teaching psychiatrist, who said that in their opinion, Trump was a malignant narcissist. They also explained that they didn’t need to necessarily have him sit in front of them as a patient because that would enable him to simply lie to them, but watching him in such a plethora of available videos, and in a variety of settings allowed them to conclude definitively that he us a malignant narcissist. Malignant narcissists can be threatening to our safety and well-being (this is a subject that Joyce Vance discusses frequently, and she acknowledges the danger of Trump should he be elected), and as these medical professionals pointed to, the traits include being aggressive, manipulative, and abusive without remorse (they quoted these descriptions from the DSM-5). According to these and other mental health professionals, sadism is a part of malignant narcissism: the individual wants to do harm to another, and Trump is expressing this. On Thanksgiving weekend, Joyce reposted a social media post from Trump, indicating his intent to punish Joyce should he be elected. On Christmas day he posted the wish for government leaders, anyone having anything to do with electric vehicles and Jack Smith to rot in hell. When his image is threatened, and I'm certain his attorneys are informing him that he’s losing ground in court, he is becoming more aggressive. While we have Trump with this diagnosed mental health condition, we don’t just have a single individual acting out: he is sending code messages to his army of supporters, and they are making death threats. He is gearing up to have a cadre of lawyers who will not follow the law should he be elected. So that is a threat to you, as well as to me and everyone else on the sub stack and the good citizens of the United States of America. So why should I and others possibly care about the founders? Because what we are experiencing is not unidimensional. We have a Christian nationalist evangelical right wing fascist faction of our government that Trump has exploited. Trump is not nor was he ever a Republican until it became expedient for him to pick that party so he could run for president with the endgame goal of being a dictator. That has always been his goal. And this faction is attempting to reframe the constitution to reflect their right wing views. I’m not saying SCOTUS has been influenced in their decision-making. I am saying this faction is attempting to influence SCOTUS to make decisions that align with far right positions: we’ve seen this with reversing, Roe v. Wade, and affirmative action. The first amendment establishes separation of church and state; it matters very much what the founders wanted when they established that. The majority weren’t Christian, at least not with a belief in the Trinity. A fair number were deists, some were agnostic but also some were atheist. There was not a single Christian nationalist evangelical right wing fascist among the founders but there were Unitarians, who rejected the idea of the Trinity. Every single one of them rejected the idea of religion as part of government, because the king of England whom they had opposed in the revolution, was the head of the church of England, and they wanted to reject having a church as part of the new government. So yes, it matters very much to a number of us here in 2024 that a Christian nationalist evangelical right wing fascist faction that worships Trump as the orange Jesus would revise history to portray the founders were right wing religious extremists as are they. By the way, Trump plays on this idea of being the ‘orange Jesus’ as he states on the campaign trail that he is ‘the chosen one’ and the MAGA go berserk on hearing that. So your final sentence or question regarding ‘whether the constitution stands to be reinterpreted in accordance with the times’ cannot be taken on its face, because ‘the times’ includes the most recent past in 2021 when Trump tried to abrogate the constitution by attempting to force our congressional leaders to accept a false slate of electors based on the lie that he won the election one. In fact, he lost it. He is abrogating the constitution that limits his term. So I have to say NO, the constitution is not reinterpreted in accordance with the times, when the times include a batshit crazy former president, who STILL at this very moment will not acknowledge that he lost the election. He is now asking the courts to re-interpret the constitution according to his batshit crazy false position. If sane, competent, qualified, appropriately appointed, and confirmed justices wish to make an interpretation of the constitution, be my guest. But it’s unacceptable to allow the misinterpretation and the false revision of history that Trump supporters would like to suggest. So if you’d like to read further on the topic, I suggest you head to the Heritage Foundation where they post Christian nationalist evangelical right wing fascist revisionist blatherskite articles, or visit Robert J. Rei’s Substack for a factual analysis of MAGA influenced publications. Then read a journal article called “Complicity in the Perversion of Justice“ by Cynthia Fontaine of Southern Illinois University, filed at Saint Mary’s University Journal on Legal, malpractice and ethics published July 2020 and it’s found in volume 10 number two. That outlines exactly what happened in Nazi Germany when Hitler and Company decided to abrogate the German constitution (which was known as a human rights document), and to fill the courts with Hitler's appointees and get rid of anyone who represented a liberal. It’s pretty much a template for what Trump is doing with the 2025 group he has formed. So indeed, I and others care very much that a malignant narcissist is the Republican frontrunner for 2024 and we are not ‘mitigating’ his behavior. Trump is dangerous and so are his weaponized followers. Those of us who recognize his mental state are extremely concerned and have been writing and posting volumes about the danger he poses to our democracy. I also know you care as well. I hope you will watch the movie ‘Unfit’ before you refute my or others comments about the likelihood of Trump imploding from malignant narcissism. A group of the top, practicing psychologists and psychiatrists in the United States would argue otherwise with you on the issue of whether, and when Trump will implode. I hope you read the journal article I recommended on how the Nazis were able to an obliterate a justice system that known as an example of one that established and protected human rights. After you read that article revisit your comment that appears to demean my concern about Trump‘s mental state: I am well aware of Trump’s psychological state of mind and the very real danger he poses to us as individuals and our entire citizenry. Few of us want to live under a fascist dictatorship. It is simply not careful thinking to minimize Trump’s behavior to that of one who is ‘non compos mentis.’ We both know that definition is never going to be applied to him. His behavior, including his plan for the future should he be elected, matches that of Hitler. Both men were/are devoid of conscience, abusive without remorse and are and were sadistic. Trump wants to subordinate our rights to his, he would like to get rid of all persons of color and those having an ideology opposite to his, and he will not abide by any sexuality other than heterosexual. He’s going to start with lawyers, he will move on to judges, and he will erase our Constitution. He has already begun to influence our rights.
I was not referring to you personally. The fact is, many people blow off the danger of Donald Trump by calling him either crazy or stupid, which he is neither.
The point of understanding the Founders intent is that "originalism" is a prevailing filter through which conservative judges decide cases and sometimes take away right we've previously fought for and won.
"Originalism" is the conservative SCOTUS members' "fig leaf" term for doing what they decried that previous more liberal Supreme Courts practiced: "Legislating from the bench." I like Jefferson's take on this, and he was surely a Founder (if not present for the Constitution's drafting as he was in France at the time): "I am certainly not an advocate for frequent and untried changes in laws and constitutions. I think moderate imperfections had better be borne with; because, when once known, we accommodate ourselves to them, and find practical means of correcting their ill effects. Laws and institutions must go hand in hand with the progress of the human mind. As that becomes more developed, more enlightened, as new discoveries are made, new truths disclosed, and manners and opinions change with the change of circumstances, institutions must advance also, and keep pace with the times."
Peter, Indeed, while Jefferson was in France during the writing of the constitution, he had a great deal of input to the constitution through his assistant whom he sent back with messengers to the writing founders with his wishes for a constitution that protected the voting rights of citizens. It was his Early work at Virginia that became the foundation for the first amendment which was the separation of church and state.
Trump has been talking nonsense, getting facts wrong, quick to anger, etc. for a long time. While I would love to believe an “implosion” is coming, what exactly is that? Short of death, I don’t know what stops him.
No enjoyment here. Even a favorable outcome leaves the nation damaged. The international community (both the good guys and the bad guys) are looking at the USA in a different light now. A ton of lost cred. All due to the dumbsh_ts who comprise a politically powerful portion of our population, and the feckless seditionist moron they chose as their leader. If I am Germany or GB or Canada or Japan, I will be very skeptical of USA's commitment to world peace and our climate, regardless of the outcome. And within, it gives me no joy to see this dark side of Americans that I once thought to be rare but now realize is everywhere.
That’s a new one, Orange Gobshite. I may have to retire Orange Cocksplat. I always enjoy that one because it brings to mind the Mexican flag the Scots flew over his Scottish golf course. Proud of my 90+%. Scots ancestry.
And may we never forget Daylin Leach's irreplaceable "fascist, loofah-faced shitgibbon". I sincerely try to avoid (what I consider) petty name-calling, but that epithet has strengthened me since 2017. :-)
I prefer Marmalade Menace. Happy New Year to all and thanks Joyce for your continued diligence in the pursuit of understanding and education for all who give a hoot about this nation and the liberties of its people. Stay strong folks as we’re, indeed, in this together.
A14 says a person who was involved in an insurrection cannot serve in office; it doesn't say they can't be elected. So we (editorial we) can simply refuse to swear them in. This, of course, raises some other questions, but I believe those could be resolved quickly and easily.
Well, I think if it got THAT far along, we'd be in the worst possible frame of "constitutional crisis" that we could imagine. My fantasy is that SCOTUS, with three Trump appointees, votes 8-0 (Thomas finally recusing himself as his wife was an insurrectionist) against Trump being on the general election ballot. Can you imagine? How would all the spineless Trump enablers in Congress react to that? I think it would shut them right up.
Actually, I sadly agree, Margaret! I'm just a naive optimist. Did you ever listen to "CarTalk" on NPR? They used a term I'd like to employ on the Congressional GOP: Time for all of them to get a good "dope slap"! ;-)
I’m even more interested in taking the congressional insurrectionists off the ballots than Trump. Without the help of Johnson and McCarthy and Boebert and Green and etc etc etc Trump would have been toast a long time ago. Not to mention the Senate cowards. They should have convicted him.
Imagine if Hillary Clinton had done any of this after losing to Trump in 2016 under highly questionable circumstances (Comey, Russia, "her emails," "deplorables comment).
It’s a mixed-article bag anyway, as Congress can grant final clemency on 14:3 couldn’t the Supreme Court slither out of the decision due to Congress’s final say?
My anger at the grip this murdering <Covid inaction> raping <E. Jean> thieving <fraud in NYC and elsewhere> son of a bitch has imposed on my country is deep and wide, and therefore my anger knows no bounds, internally. Externally, I read, study, talk write and call anyone and everyone who might listen. I vote for dog catcher and I vote for president and I vote for everything in between. I'm not confused, I know what I can do. I do it. Each one of us owns this democratic republic. This is no time to feel or be helpless. Not for anyone. Do everything you can do, every damned day, including keeping your chin up and not being "afraid" or "tired". We can cry with relief later. Gotta get busy right now. Happy new year, you still have the chance to help stop this!
I’m printing your comment so I can put it above my desk, so that I can read it, nod in agreement, feel affirmed that indeed, we are all in this together.
"Do everything you can every damned day" is our battle cry!
Courage is not the absence of fear; it's pressing on despite feeling afraid. We are all afraid of losing something precious.
I mourn the loss of a peaceful retirement. After 40 years of life and death responsibility as a critical care nurse, I am physically and mentally tired. Was shocked to realize Democracy has become my latest patient. There is no time for tired.
I wrote and sent stacks of postcards to urge voters to the polls in support of Ohio's issue 1. Abortion rights were restored. I intend to send a mountain of postcards urging people to vote in the November election. "Don't let what you CAN'T do stop you from doing what you CAN do."
My biggest question is this: if the Supreme Court decides that a sitting President is immune, wouldn’t that apply to the current President as well? Couldn’t president Biden have immunity for anything he might determine is necessary to save the Republic?
I'm with ya, Cynthia. But also, wouldn't this make it possible for Biden to "find" some way to support Ukraine without waiting for congress to decide what they want to do?? And, am I wrong, or did TFG actually take money from one pot and put it into building a small section of his stupid wall?? I think Ukraine is more critical than a stupid wall, any day of the week.
We SOOOO need to support Ukraine! As has been said, we can help Ukraine fight off Putin over there, without our troops, or we can turn our backs on them and we will be fighting Putin with OUR men via NATO. How ignorant is our present congress? Oh, that’s right, they’re republicans in control.
Let’s not complicate issues. This is about saving our democracy. The wall and saving Ukraine are different issues. A President with immunity could do whatever he wanted, couldn’t he/she?
I am so very glad I found your letters. They have helped be to remain somewhat sane. I live in a Red state & it drives me bananas when our gov does asinine, even cruel actions such as putting barbed wire at the border between tx and Mexico!
I hear the fireworks going off as the new year begins and God help us if we don’t get rid of tfg & his maggots before they destroy our country. Again, thank you for your letters, happy new year to you, your family, and you adorable critters!
I don’t see why you state D Deakins comment is not about ‘saving our democracy.’ The two issues they address have great importance to saving our democracy.
President Biden has sent money to Israel bypassing congress. He should do the same for Ukraine. He should also call for Netanyahu (the equivalent of the orange traitor in the U.S.) to step down. Ukraine is defending itself...Netanyahu is killing indiscriminately and should be stopped.
Excellent point. However President Biden is too fine a person to resort to such an action. To do such an action would, in my opinion, require declaring Marshal Law to put troops on the streets.
I believe that it will require aggressive actions to root out insurrectionists throughout all levels of government. Certain state government leaders are incompatible with democracy.
Spelling is strongly linked to credibility. I absorbed plenty from your comment, but I and many others flinch when we see things like "Marshal." Don't be so hard on yourself, just be mindful. I'm sorry, didn't mean to upset you.
Guess it’s still early for me. I hate incorrect spelling and tenses also. I’m glad you absorbed plenty. I do put thought into what and how I say something.
You're raising mechanical procedure as a way to avoid the problem you anticipate. Biden, in your scenario, would have immunity only if nobody chose to file a court challenge, and then, only if every relevant court ruled in Biden's favor.
When Abraham Lincoln was in his first months as president, he took various unconstitutional actions to suppress the rebellion. He prevented the Maryland legislature from sitting, because its governor, a patriot, had informed him that if it met, the majority would vote for secession. He declared martial law (including emplacing Col Ben Butler as a military governor in Annapolis, to suppress the state legislature using his 7th NY and another regiment).
When Congress reconvened, Lincoln sent a full report of every act he took that he thought exceeded his Constitutional powers, with a request that Congress endorse the actions as necessary.
Congress voted to approve Lincoln's actions.
By then, all insurrectionist Members had done the relatively "right" thing -- they resigned, some to actually take up arms against the USA. Congress' vote was overwhelming; only loyal Unionists remained!
Today, if only Hawley, MTG, et al., would have the same decency!
(OTOH, Lincoln contradicted or ignored every word Roger Brook Taney, chief justice of the Supreme Court, issued! cf ex parte Merriman on the issue of habeas corpus in Maryland)
I think that in Bush v. Gore the Supreme Court invented a new Constitutional right to put the election loser in the White House but also made it applicable to only that one case (that's based on accounts I have read; I haven't read the opinion itself). I suppose they could do something similar now.
I’ve thought the same. They don’t get that they are opening Pandora’s box. While I might appreciate what Biden could do to end some of this mess, the precedent would be unthinkable.
“….if the Supreme Court decides that a sitting President is immune wouldn’t that apply to the current President as well?”
Perhaps this would apply to the current President. But therein lies the rub, the greater concern: What if the SCOTUS does rule a president is immune but delays making that decision until after the November election and (god forbid) tfg wins.
i have about 3 hours of 2023 left and I can't wait to burn my calendar. When Donald was still in office I made my family doctor promise to keep me alive until Donald went to prison. My family doctor did his darndest. The past year I had as close a call as anyone can have, but I was fortunate to have doctors i had never heard of keep me going. It's been a nightmare, but my children helped mightily and I've progressed -- but on days when therapy seems too boring or too much, that Dastardly Dictator wannabe is still on my mind, and I won't give up.
Joyce, your above explanations of the law help me keep my faith. This democracy needs to continue and all the people who fought in wars to assure that it does, and all those people who have aided our democracy through taking office and remaining true to our Constitution, and all the people who willingly work in our government because it IS a democracy -- should have the profound support and thanks of all Americans.
May 2024 see this beloved country gain back its pride and may America again be the shining star of hope to the world that it was. Vote !
Barbara, you still have spit and grit in you! Keep at it! Your dastardly doctors are motivating you for a reason and that’s to keep your mind and heart ticking. Do the dang therapy, even if you despise it. We need you here for the 2024 fight!
Keep working to stay healthy, faithful, alive to see this country come to its sense! This is the shinning star of the world! We want ll make sure it continues!
Good tidings to you, and thank you for your spunk and determination! I am proud to be your countryman. I wish you many comfortable days, and I hope you're around to see the orange traitor go to prison where he belongs!
I am so grateful to everyone who "liked" my comment, and to those who replied. I've been on this substack situation since late November and am so pleased i have a place to voice what i feel. This 2024 is going to be full of ups and downs for those of us who don't want Donald anywhere near our presidency. Thanks to Mary, Joyce and E.Jean for giving us their perspectives, and encouraging us to voice our own. I don't operate a substack myself -- in fact it took me a couple of weeks to even figure out what one is! Bless you all and full steam ahead!
Joyce, wishing you and your loved ones (furry, feathered and otherwise) a healthy, happy new year! It remains an important fact that people as honest, intelligent, kind, brave and strong as you, are visible and continuing to tell the truth about what is going on in American politics and the danger the Republican party represents to our precious democracy. Thank you very much for who you are and what you do. And with apologies to Alabama fans, Go Blue!
Democracy is on the line folks! Please do everything in your power to get out the vote and to encourage 18 to 29s to register and vote. We are depending on you as www.TurnUp.US, Zev Shapiro and I will be working very hard every single day to accomplish that result as well.
Many many thanks; they are excellent and effective!!well worth it if everyone would go to www.TurnUp.US and generously contribute plus spread the word to your friends and family!
Absolutely agree; it is truly sickening. However, we must understand the details so that we can not only understand for ourselves, but be able to explain to those who are either ambivalent, or who are so weary of all of this that they are ignoring the facts and details. It is only through understanding that each of us can come to the truth.
Get used to it.. we will have to suffer with this for 10 more months and a few days in november to see if we get free of this existential menace...unless something unexpected happens..
One good thing that’s come out of the election of Trump in 2016 is that many of us previously “informed consistent voters but not activists” became activists. It started with the Women’s March in Jan 2017 and continues until today. We work very hard to fight for our rights and the good of our country. We’ve also become best friends. People talk about the rift in older friendships “now that we know”. But I’m far more happy about my new ones than I am sad about my old ones. I admit it’s a lot of boomer women. We have the time because we’re retired, and we especially value the men and young people who help us do big things. We’ve flipped congressional seats, our county now has more Democrats than Republicans, we finally got our board of supervisors working well, and we’re working on our school boards (win some, lose some). We raise our voices, carry signs, we organize, hold debates, register voters, make big and small donations, organize volunteers, knock on doors, text voters, help other states, write postcards, and do phonebanking. But our favorite is to wave signs over the 405 fwy so all the people stuck in traffic see us waving giant signs and encouraging them to honk for individual candidates. This is going to help us in 2024. We need to get the truth out about whose fault the price of hamburger really is. We will. It’s not Joe Biden’s fault and Republicans have no plan to address it anyway.
Yes we boomers are in it to win but I want to give much credit to the African American women who turn out the votes in every election. They educate and preach to their neighbors, families, and friends about getting to the polls or to be assisted to getting there. Their work is to be commended and if the Democratic Party doesn’t come through, then we all lose. That’s a fact.
So true, and something I point out all the time to help keep spirits up and all of us energized. There are millions more people now than in 2015 who are showing high levels of civic engagement. Even though I've been active in electoral politics and nonviolent civil disobedience and direct action for social and environmental justice, for some 45 years, I myself have seen my own civics knowledge skyrocket through reading HCR and Joyce Vance and Robert Hubbell and Jay Kuo. And I, like millions, have been doing phone banking and letter writing and other get out the vote work that I never did before. This is what a democracy looks like!
Hi Eric, a point, but I hope not received as trivia is that 45% of eligible voters in 2024 will be Millenial and Gen Zs. And many of them are first time voters - most will be for Biden (against Trump). I love these young folks, who have BS detectors a mile high. The can tell whom they can trust in a nano-second. We Blue's should not be so arrogant to think that they approve the Democrat Party agenda carte blanche because they do not. They just detest Trump. And if we hope to have them join 'us' (I personally do), we need to show them something of value. Otherwise, they will form their own party. I love their honesty and intelligence. They are smart enough to not split their votes, but 'warning' because they are not taken in by anything the Democrats have to offer. They just want to do everything they can to dismiss Trump permanently. We cannot relax and rest with that - we need to do everything possible to defeat Trump - as you have recommended, with phone-banking and letter writing, etc.
GenZ’ers are truly our hope. Don’t know if anyone follows Victor Shi or David Hogg but they both have hundreds of thousands of followers. Hogg and the wonderful Maxwell Frost plus Shi do an amazing job keeping people up-to-date on things people should care about.
Thank you Marlene! Indeed, I will check out Victor Shi and David Hogg. I adore the late born millennial, who are almost Gen Z - just on the edge, a couple of years, older and can mentor them. I’ve always said the Gen Z should’ve come with a warning label on them :-) they simply have the kind of detector that cuts through everything. I respect them so because of the way they’ve handled what they have inherited. And we need to really think about this precious generation, because we collectively have not made good decisions about the environment or anything else that impacts them. They are lovely to work with:))
We must engage them to look at the bigger picture as many are outraged over what they see as Biden’s neglect in Gaza and continued support of Israel. They can’t get beyond it to see that no vote or a third party vote or a vote for trump is much, much worse.
I love what you are doing Eric. Having a positive critical mass is so important. We are in this together because of Joyce’s leadership. But as well, we are supporting one another and learning from other Substack members. For example, I have been given terrific referrals to books and movies (The movie 'Unfit,' that I had not seen; most effective groups for postcard writing campaigns:)
This is quite a diversion and perhaps too gay , but I came across this poem to tonight and with all the crap going on and hate against all I thought a good way to end the year in Ecuador is the wise words of Walt Whitman ... a pioneer from my town of birth
From the Calamus Poems by Walt Whitman (1891-1892)
THIS MOMENT YEARNING AND THOUGHTFUL. THIS moment yearning and thoughtful sitting alone, It seems to me there are other men in other lands yearning and
thoughtful, It seems to me I can look over and behold them in Germany,
Italy, France, Spain, Or far, far away, in China, or in Russia or Japan, talking other
dialects, And it seems to me if I could know those men I should become attached to them as I do to men in my own lands, 0I know we should be brethren and lovers,
Hi Mike, Walt Whitman is not 'too gay.' It should not matter whether gay or not, but my now deceased husband and I (we are/were heterosexual) both loved Whitman and used to take turns reading his poems to one another: he is for everyone, so thank you for sharing him with us tonight. Thank you so much for giving us this reminder tonight that 'we are all in this together.' For me the most fitting example is his 'Song of Myself.' I hope you are having the happiest of New Years 💙
FOURTEEN AMENDMENT: Much of the debate on this seems to quietly accept that we needn’t or that it wouldn’t be prudent to follow the law because it would be disruptive, because Trump voters would be outraged, because “the voters should decide.”
Just another way to say Trump’s above the law.
If you just follow the constitution, it seems obvious there was an attempt through violence to substitute someone for the person elected -- an insurrection -- and that Trump deliberately launched it.
The general doesn’t usually follow the troops into battle. Trump didn’t. But everyone knows it was Trump’s insurrection , ax both congressional leaders of his own party said at the time. That he watched it for hours without restraining them proves they were doing his biding.
Whether Trump is on the ballot or not, one way or the other, tens of millions of Americans will be outraged. Let’s ignore that and follow the law. Of course, the black-robed GOP agents on the Supreme Court aren’t likely to do that.
My New Year’s resolution: Repeat for everyone to please write in hard copy, in email, on social media; plead with President Biden to commence a fireside chat with the nation along the lines of FDR. Biden is clearly losing the PR on his administration. No mater how effective he can be but limited given the ferocity of partisan politics, to be effective. We need to hear him. The undecided need to hear him. Progressives need to hear him. Moderate republicans needs to hear him. Biden needs to humanize himself.
So let’s all make a commitment to repeat this request of Biden over and over and over again. He is clearly losing the PR war and I don’t think he understands it from his vantage.
Please let’s get this message out. We want President Biden to begin his Fireside Chats.
Hillary Clinton made election-losing assumptions, and therefore fatal campaign mis-steps in a race she should not have lost. Al Gore was pretty wooden as well - and should have won easily. I trust Joe Biden doesn't go down the same Democratic lukewarm path ... he already has several strikes against him, and some pretty lousy polling numbers.
I agree with everything you just mention. However, it was Bill Clinton’s need to get BJs from an intern that cast a pall over Gore’s chances besides him being uptight.
I sensed that he was going to be one of the great presidents of out time. Instead we bought an idiot that led us into unnecessary wars and equally horrible, regressive worthless Supreme Court justices.
Happy New Year Joyce!! I’m am truly grateful for your commitment to the ‘cause’ here, and your exceptionally informative messages. And selfishly speaking...I need more Omletta! The BEST name ever for a chicken ! 😊 a genius name... take care
In Michigan, the ballot allowance for Trump is solely for the primary at this point. If he wins that stage, we all expect an immediate lawsuit to ban him from the general presidential ballot. Stay tuned!
Thank you, counselor. You make a huge difference in the world, honesty and clarity and the truth. It will keep us or set us free happy new year don’t stop.
Happy New Year, Joyce! Wishing you and your family a wonderful 2024! Thank you for all you do to keep us informed. Reading your Substack helps keep me sane in these crazy times brought on by tfg and those who continue to support his antics. Looking forward to lots of critter pictures in the new year! All so very cute! 💙
Thank you, Joyce. Happy New Year to you.
Trump's cronies will whine whether he loses the election OR is removed from the ballot. So remove him. What's the point of having the 14th amendment if it isn't going to be enforced as it so urgently needs to be right now? What's the point of having laws at all then? He needs to be removed from the ballot, and so does every other Congressional Rep or other public official who helped him. Because that's the law.
I say this often. If the amendment isn’t enforced, get rid of it. Every republican insurrectionist who signed the Paxton brief and the exprez all broke their oaths to uphold our Constitution. They have no business being in Congress. That Mike Johnson who slithered around and was instrumental in the attempted coup is now Speaker is just insane.
Deb, I could NOT agree with you more!! Why do we even have laws if we're ALL not accountable to them??
We should recognize that the 14th Amendment does not explicitly require keeping Trump off the ballot. Colorado and Maine have excluded him, because state law requires that those on the ballot be eligible. There may be states that allow ineligible candidates to be on the ballot—so much the worse for their voters. If the Supreme Court rules Trump ineligible, as it should, we shall then face the question of whether he may still appear in some states. Frankly, my political side would relish such a situation and the utter chaos it would cause for the Republican Party.
I think this is a great observation. I wonder what other states require that a candidate must be eligible to run. As I understand it, the SC can make a general ruling based on the facts in one case --am I right all you lawyers out there?. So couldn't the SC rule that candidates must be eligible to run for President to be put on the ballot in all States? And that the Colorado case proves that Trump was responsible for an insurrection. So let the R's complain. They are going to complain and possibly worse when he is soundly beat at the ballot box in the fall anyway. And we might be back in the same situation again.
States control elections, except to the extent that Congress uses its power to set conditions. As far as I know, Congress has not provided that a candidate need be eligible to be on the ballot. I have been told by other commenters on the 'net that some states allowed people too young to serve to be third-party candidates. So I don't think that the Supremes could order that only eligible people be on the ballot. Congress probably could, but that's not going to happen this year. The need to know that is one reason I expect the Supreme Court to take the Colorado case straight away, and to hear argument and decided it in an accelerated manner. But I have no particular expertise.
I agree 100%! I'm tired of the Republican threats! Don't hold us DEMS hostage! Call them on their threats!! Enough!
Well said, and I'm wondering if the Orange Gobshite will top his Xmas "goodwill toward all" message by a New Year's rant to exceed all rants...folks, we're watching real-time streaming of a man losing what remaining purchase he has on his sanity, a remarkable body of work that will provide material for hundreds - nay, thousands - of PhD theses in the years to come.
Enjoy the show, you'll never see anything like this in your lifetime.
I predict a psychotic break when he is defeated again. Why the man has not been declared mentally incompetent making him unfit to serve is beyond me. The alternate universe he exists in belongs in a mental hospital where people will be paid to agree with his rantings and he never leaves the walls of the institution. God help America.
I don’t see his ranting any more, and I’m not sure the faux nooz fans do either.
Imagine him on a debate stage.
I can, and that’s why he won’t.
I imagine that. He has gotten good at it. The man can talk and rant and gish gallop. Biden, BTW, cannot. Neither could Hillary. It matters not the falsehoods so much, as the presentation. The MAGGOT base would be creaming their jeans with every bomb that Trump throws. We can only hope that Biden's record remains strong and gets stronger without any meaningful October surprises. That will keep Trump's distortions and lies as transparent and obvious as possible.
I bet if you were around the man-child you’d find he says basically the same thing with the same little words. All. The. Time. Never anything new just the same old thing.
I really do want to see him on a debate stage. If he gets that fair.
I was thinking a commentor was right, thst he could get elected, but couldn’t serve. Wouldn’t that be bizarre?
Lance, Some of us have been waiting for the moment of narcissistic implosion. Perhaps Trump is having a rolling event: there was the food plate event that Cassidy Hutchinson testified to with ketchup running down the wall of the executive dining room when he had a fit over Bill Barr saying Trump was full of lies about winning the election - and this was before January 6 or the indictments. He forgot he raped E. Jean Carroll and sued her for defamation when she said he had raped her (following the May trial in which he was found guilty for sexual assault, and then Judge Kaplan explained to him that 'you raped her.' But he also forgot that he ran against Biden in 2020 and claimed he ran against Obama; he posted a recent social media diatribe in which he blasted the 'Afghanistan surrender' (I believe he arranged this under the Doha agreement); and in the same post told world leaders and All Ellectric Car Lunacy' and deranged Jack Smith to rot in hell....(Merry Christmas?). Some of this may be fatigue - memory loss - but given that he is on his second gag order, perhaps a bit of implosion is in play. I hope there will be PhD dissertations - but going back to the founders with complete and definitive biographies on all. We have wonderful biographies on major writers but not an entire set of biographies for all founders with collections of personal letters, diaries, and session notes. Until we have this kind of work, we won't have a triangulated view of 'what the Founders really meant' when they wrote the Constitution - because while there were primary writers, there were many supporting and contradicting views, including disagreements and compromises. Then we can really compare what this unhinged past president has done to us.
Trump isn't crazy. We have to stop mitigating his actions by saying he's simply non compos mentis. He has managed to manipulate people, and the press, for decades, which is not something a crazy person could possibly do. He will not "implode" either. Trump is too feral for that,
And who the hell cares what the Founding Fathers meant? It's 2024, not the 1700's. Any Constitution stands to be reinterpreted in accordance with the times, no?
Marycat2021,
I did not say Trump was ‘crazy.’ That’s too simplistic of a term to describe his psychological condition. And I am not mitigating his actions. You may wish to watch ‘Unfit,’ a movie from 2020 in which former Trump staffers and others who had known him over time and observed him on many occasions, described his behavior as erratic, and used terms such as ‘unhinged’ (George Conway) and pathologically mentally unfit (John Kelly). Other interviewees in the movie included clinical psychologists, a practicing psychiatrist as well as a teaching psychiatrist, who said that in their opinion, Trump was a malignant narcissist. They also explained that they didn’t need to necessarily have him sit in front of them as a patient because that would enable him to simply lie to them, but watching him in such a plethora of available videos, and in a variety of settings allowed them to conclude definitively that he us a malignant narcissist. Malignant narcissists can be threatening to our safety and well-being (this is a subject that Joyce Vance discusses frequently, and she acknowledges the danger of Trump should he be elected), and as these medical professionals pointed to, the traits include being aggressive, manipulative, and abusive without remorse (they quoted these descriptions from the DSM-5). According to these and other mental health professionals, sadism is a part of malignant narcissism: the individual wants to do harm to another, and Trump is expressing this. On Thanksgiving weekend, Joyce reposted a social media post from Trump, indicating his intent to punish Joyce should he be elected. On Christmas day he posted the wish for government leaders, anyone having anything to do with electric vehicles and Jack Smith to rot in hell. When his image is threatened, and I'm certain his attorneys are informing him that he’s losing ground in court, he is becoming more aggressive. While we have Trump with this diagnosed mental health condition, we don’t just have a single individual acting out: he is sending code messages to his army of supporters, and they are making death threats. He is gearing up to have a cadre of lawyers who will not follow the law should he be elected. So that is a threat to you, as well as to me and everyone else on the sub stack and the good citizens of the United States of America. So why should I and others possibly care about the founders? Because what we are experiencing is not unidimensional. We have a Christian nationalist evangelical right wing fascist faction of our government that Trump has exploited. Trump is not nor was he ever a Republican until it became expedient for him to pick that party so he could run for president with the endgame goal of being a dictator. That has always been his goal. And this faction is attempting to reframe the constitution to reflect their right wing views. I’m not saying SCOTUS has been influenced in their decision-making. I am saying this faction is attempting to influence SCOTUS to make decisions that align with far right positions: we’ve seen this with reversing, Roe v. Wade, and affirmative action. The first amendment establishes separation of church and state; it matters very much what the founders wanted when they established that. The majority weren’t Christian, at least not with a belief in the Trinity. A fair number were deists, some were agnostic but also some were atheist. There was not a single Christian nationalist evangelical right wing fascist among the founders but there were Unitarians, who rejected the idea of the Trinity. Every single one of them rejected the idea of religion as part of government, because the king of England whom they had opposed in the revolution, was the head of the church of England, and they wanted to reject having a church as part of the new government. So yes, it matters very much to a number of us here in 2024 that a Christian nationalist evangelical right wing fascist faction that worships Trump as the orange Jesus would revise history to portray the founders were right wing religious extremists as are they. By the way, Trump plays on this idea of being the ‘orange Jesus’ as he states on the campaign trail that he is ‘the chosen one’ and the MAGA go berserk on hearing that. So your final sentence or question regarding ‘whether the constitution stands to be reinterpreted in accordance with the times’ cannot be taken on its face, because ‘the times’ includes the most recent past in 2021 when Trump tried to abrogate the constitution by attempting to force our congressional leaders to accept a false slate of electors based on the lie that he won the election one. In fact, he lost it. He is abrogating the constitution that limits his term. So I have to say NO, the constitution is not reinterpreted in accordance with the times, when the times include a batshit crazy former president, who STILL at this very moment will not acknowledge that he lost the election. He is now asking the courts to re-interpret the constitution according to his batshit crazy false position. If sane, competent, qualified, appropriately appointed, and confirmed justices wish to make an interpretation of the constitution, be my guest. But it’s unacceptable to allow the misinterpretation and the false revision of history that Trump supporters would like to suggest. So if you’d like to read further on the topic, I suggest you head to the Heritage Foundation where they post Christian nationalist evangelical right wing fascist revisionist blatherskite articles, or visit Robert J. Rei’s Substack for a factual analysis of MAGA influenced publications. Then read a journal article called “Complicity in the Perversion of Justice“ by Cynthia Fontaine of Southern Illinois University, filed at Saint Mary’s University Journal on Legal, malpractice and ethics published July 2020 and it’s found in volume 10 number two. That outlines exactly what happened in Nazi Germany when Hitler and Company decided to abrogate the German constitution (which was known as a human rights document), and to fill the courts with Hitler's appointees and get rid of anyone who represented a liberal. It’s pretty much a template for what Trump is doing with the 2025 group he has formed. So indeed, I and others care very much that a malignant narcissist is the Republican frontrunner for 2024 and we are not ‘mitigating’ his behavior. Trump is dangerous and so are his weaponized followers. Those of us who recognize his mental state are extremely concerned and have been writing and posting volumes about the danger he poses to our democracy. I also know you care as well. I hope you will watch the movie ‘Unfit’ before you refute my or others comments about the likelihood of Trump imploding from malignant narcissism. A group of the top, practicing psychologists and psychiatrists in the United States would argue otherwise with you on the issue of whether, and when Trump will implode. I hope you read the journal article I recommended on how the Nazis were able to an obliterate a justice system that known as an example of one that established and protected human rights. After you read that article revisit your comment that appears to demean my concern about Trump‘s mental state: I am well aware of Trump’s psychological state of mind and the very real danger he poses to us as individuals and our entire citizenry. Few of us want to live under a fascist dictatorship. It is simply not careful thinking to minimize Trump’s behavior to that of one who is ‘non compos mentis.’ We both know that definition is never going to be applied to him. His behavior, including his plan for the future should he be elected, matches that of Hitler. Both men were/are devoid of conscience, abusive without remorse and are and were sadistic. Trump wants to subordinate our rights to his, he would like to get rid of all persons of color and those having an ideology opposite to his, and he will not abide by any sexuality other than heterosexual. He’s going to start with lawyers, he will move on to judges, and he will erase our Constitution. He has already begun to influence our rights.
I was not referring to you personally. The fact is, many people blow off the danger of Donald Trump by calling him either crazy or stupid, which he is neither.
The point of understanding the Founders intent is that "originalism" is a prevailing filter through which conservative judges decide cases and sometimes take away right we've previously fought for and won.
"Originalism" is the conservative SCOTUS members' "fig leaf" term for doing what they decried that previous more liberal Supreme Courts practiced: "Legislating from the bench." I like Jefferson's take on this, and he was surely a Founder (if not present for the Constitution's drafting as he was in France at the time): "I am certainly not an advocate for frequent and untried changes in laws and constitutions. I think moderate imperfections had better be borne with; because, when once known, we accommodate ourselves to them, and find practical means of correcting their ill effects. Laws and institutions must go hand in hand with the progress of the human mind. As that becomes more developed, more enlightened, as new discoveries are made, new truths disclosed, and manners and opinions change with the change of circumstances, institutions must advance also, and keep pace with the times."
Peter, Indeed, while Jefferson was in France during the writing of the constitution, he had a great deal of input to the constitution through his assistant whom he sent back with messengers to the writing founders with his wishes for a constitution that protected the voting rights of citizens. It was his Early work at Virginia that became the foundation for the first amendment which was the separation of church and state.
He's not crazy, he's a damn criminal and belongs in prison.
Trump has been talking nonsense, getting facts wrong, quick to anger, etc. for a long time. While I would love to believe an “implosion” is coming, what exactly is that? Short of death, I don’t know what stops him.
No enjoyment here. Even a favorable outcome leaves the nation damaged. The international community (both the good guys and the bad guys) are looking at the USA in a different light now. A ton of lost cred. All due to the dumbsh_ts who comprise a politically powerful portion of our population, and the feckless seditionist moron they chose as their leader. If I am Germany or GB or Canada or Japan, I will be very skeptical of USA's commitment to world peace and our climate, regardless of the outcome. And within, it gives me no joy to see this dark side of Americans that I once thought to be rare but now realize is everywhere.
That’s a new one, Orange Gobshite. I may have to retire Orange Cocksplat. I always enjoy that one because it brings to mind the Mexican flag the Scots flew over his Scottish golf course. Proud of my 90+%. Scots ancestry.
And may we never forget Daylin Leach's irreplaceable "fascist, loofah-faced shitgibbon". I sincerely try to avoid (what I consider) petty name-calling, but that epithet has strengthened me since 2017. :-)
I prefer Marmalade Menace. Happy New Year to all and thanks Joyce for your continued diligence in the pursuit of understanding and education for all who give a hoot about this nation and the liberties of its people. Stay strong folks as we’re, indeed, in this together.
I’m sorry I missed that! Hoping there is a picture somewhere
A14 says a person who was involved in an insurrection cannot serve in office; it doesn't say they can't be elected. So we (editorial we) can simply refuse to swear them in. This, of course, raises some other questions, but I believe those could be resolved quickly and easily.
Well, I think if it got THAT far along, we'd be in the worst possible frame of "constitutional crisis" that we could imagine. My fantasy is that SCOTUS, with three Trump appointees, votes 8-0 (Thomas finally recusing himself as his wife was an insurrectionist) against Trump being on the general election ballot. Can you imagine? How would all the spineless Trump enablers in Congress react to that? I think it would shut them right up.
Peter, nothing will shut them up, IMHO.
Actually, I sadly agree, Margaret! I'm just a naive optimist. Did you ever listen to "CarTalk" on NPR? They used a term I'd like to employ on the Congressional GOP: Time for all of them to get a good "dope slap"! ;-)
I'd be more than happy to deliver the (figurative) "dope slap." And we need all the naive optimists we can find. Thanks.
I agree, Deb. If we let them cherry-pick from the Constitution, it will be full of holes and no longer the law of the land.
It's not cherry picking. It's the law.
I’m even more interested in taking the congressional insurrectionists off the ballots than Trump. Without the help of Johnson and McCarthy and Boebert and Green and etc etc etc Trump would have been toast a long time ago. Not to mention the Senate cowards. They should have convicted him.
Absolutely!
ALL of them. The damage they continue to cause is unbelievable.
Deb,
Well said. I’m with you!
Imagine if Hillary Clinton had done any of this after losing to Trump in 2016 under highly questionable circumstances (Comey, Russia, "her emails," "deplorables comment).
It’s a mixed-article bag anyway, as Congress can grant final clemency on 14:3 couldn’t the Supreme Court slither out of the decision due to Congress’s final say?
My anger at the grip this murdering <Covid inaction> raping <E. Jean> thieving <fraud in NYC and elsewhere> son of a bitch has imposed on my country is deep and wide, and therefore my anger knows no bounds, internally. Externally, I read, study, talk write and call anyone and everyone who might listen. I vote for dog catcher and I vote for president and I vote for everything in between. I'm not confused, I know what I can do. I do it. Each one of us owns this democratic republic. This is no time to feel or be helpless. Not for anyone. Do everything you can do, every damned day, including keeping your chin up and not being "afraid" or "tired". We can cry with relief later. Gotta get busy right now. Happy new year, you still have the chance to help stop this!
Yes ! It will take us women to save the republic ! Vote Blue💙💙
Imagine if all the women voted…and voted blue so as not to shoot themselves in the foot…my God! How beautiful it will be!!!
I’m printing your comment so I can put it above my desk, so that I can read it, nod in agreement, feel affirmed that indeed, we are all in this together.
Hear, hear! Damn straight and right on, sister! Most excellently said.
Mimi - excellent post!
"Do everything you can every damned day" is our battle cry!
Courage is not the absence of fear; it's pressing on despite feeling afraid. We are all afraid of losing something precious.
I mourn the loss of a peaceful retirement. After 40 years of life and death responsibility as a critical care nurse, I am physically and mentally tired. Was shocked to realize Democracy has become my latest patient. There is no time for tired.
I wrote and sent stacks of postcards to urge voters to the polls in support of Ohio's issue 1. Abortion rights were restored. I intend to send a mountain of postcards urging people to vote in the November election. "Don't let what you CAN'T do stop you from doing what you CAN do."
My biggest question is this: if the Supreme Court decides that a sitting President is immune, wouldn’t that apply to the current President as well? Couldn’t president Biden have immunity for anything he might determine is necessary to save the Republic?
I'm with ya, Cynthia. But also, wouldn't this make it possible for Biden to "find" some way to support Ukraine without waiting for congress to decide what they want to do?? And, am I wrong, or did TFG actually take money from one pot and put it into building a small section of his stupid wall?? I think Ukraine is more critical than a stupid wall, any day of the week.
We SOOOO need to support Ukraine! As has been said, we can help Ukraine fight off Putin over there, without our troops, or we can turn our backs on them and we will be fighting Putin with OUR men via NATO. How ignorant is our present congress? Oh, that’s right, they’re republicans in control.
AGREED!! I thought of this yesterday:
Republicans are on the Stupid Spectrum. On the Far Right side of the Spectrum, at that!
(meaning no disrespect to any other spectrum, but we really should acknowledge that there is a Stupid Spectrum, and who's on it)
Let’s not complicate issues. This is about saving our democracy. The wall and saving Ukraine are different issues. A President with immunity could do whatever he wanted, couldn’t he/she?
I am so very glad I found your letters. They have helped be to remain somewhat sane. I live in a Red state & it drives me bananas when our gov does asinine, even cruel actions such as putting barbed wire at the border between tx and Mexico!
I hear the fireworks going off as the new year begins and God help us if we don’t get rid of tfg & his maggots before they destroy our country. Again, thank you for your letters, happy new year to you, your family, and you adorable critters!
Yes, I'd think full immunity could allow any president to do what they wanted.
I don’t see why you state D Deakins comment is not about ‘saving our democracy.’ The two issues they address have great importance to saving our democracy.
President Biden has sent money to Israel bypassing congress. He should do the same for Ukraine. He should also call for Netanyahu (the equivalent of the orange traitor in the U.S.) to step down. Ukraine is defending itself...Netanyahu is killing indiscriminately and should be stopped.
Excellent point. However President Biden is too fine a person to resort to such an action. To do such an action would, in my opinion, require declaring Marshal Law to put troops on the streets.
I believe that it will require aggressive actions to root out insurrectionists throughout all levels of government. Certain state government leaders are incompatible with democracy.
It's martial law, not Marshal. Sigh.
Guess I was too tired to spell check. Glad that was the most that you absorbed from my comment.
Spelling is strongly linked to credibility. I absorbed plenty from your comment, but I and many others flinch when we see things like "Marshal." Don't be so hard on yourself, just be mindful. I'm sorry, didn't mean to upset you.
Guess it’s still early for me. I hate incorrect spelling and tenses also. I’m glad you absorbed plenty. I do put thought into what and how I say something.
I got the point, sigh...
You're raising mechanical procedure as a way to avoid the problem you anticipate. Biden, in your scenario, would have immunity only if nobody chose to file a court challenge, and then, only if every relevant court ruled in Biden's favor.
When Abraham Lincoln was in his first months as president, he took various unconstitutional actions to suppress the rebellion. He prevented the Maryland legislature from sitting, because its governor, a patriot, had informed him that if it met, the majority would vote for secession. He declared martial law (including emplacing Col Ben Butler as a military governor in Annapolis, to suppress the state legislature using his 7th NY and another regiment).
When Congress reconvened, Lincoln sent a full report of every act he took that he thought exceeded his Constitutional powers, with a request that Congress endorse the actions as necessary.
Congress voted to approve Lincoln's actions.
By then, all insurrectionist Members had done the relatively "right" thing -- they resigned, some to actually take up arms against the USA. Congress' vote was overwhelming; only loyal Unionists remained!
Today, if only Hawley, MTG, et al., would have the same decency!
(OTOH, Lincoln contradicted or ignored every word Roger Brook Taney, chief justice of the Supreme Court, issued! cf ex parte Merriman on the issue of habeas corpus in Maryland)
"there's the rub" - Hamlet
I think that in Bush v. Gore the Supreme Court invented a new Constitutional right to put the election loser in the White House but also made it applicable to only that one case (that's based on accounts I have read; I haven't read the opinion itself). I suppose they could do something similar now.
I’ve thought the same. They don’t get that they are opening Pandora’s box. While I might appreciate what Biden could do to end some of this mess, the precedent would be unthinkable.
“….if the Supreme Court decides that a sitting President is immune wouldn’t that apply to the current President as well?”
Perhaps this would apply to the current President. But therein lies the rub, the greater concern: What if the SCOTUS does rule a president is immune but delays making that decision until after the November election and (god forbid) tfg wins.
i have about 3 hours of 2023 left and I can't wait to burn my calendar. When Donald was still in office I made my family doctor promise to keep me alive until Donald went to prison. My family doctor did his darndest. The past year I had as close a call as anyone can have, but I was fortunate to have doctors i had never heard of keep me going. It's been a nightmare, but my children helped mightily and I've progressed -- but on days when therapy seems too boring or too much, that Dastardly Dictator wannabe is still on my mind, and I won't give up.
Joyce, your above explanations of the law help me keep my faith. This democracy needs to continue and all the people who fought in wars to assure that it does, and all those people who have aided our democracy through taking office and remaining true to our Constitution, and all the people who willingly work in our government because it IS a democracy -- should have the profound support and thanks of all Americans.
May 2024 see this beloved country gain back its pride and may America again be the shining star of hope to the world that it was. Vote !
Barbara, you still have spit and grit in you! Keep at it! Your dastardly doctors are motivating you for a reason and that’s to keep your mind and heart ticking. Do the dang therapy, even if you despise it. We need you here for the 2024 fight!
Keep working to stay healthy, faithful, alive to see this country come to its sense! This is the shinning star of the world! We want ll make sure it continues!
Keep the faith, Barbara! May we “see” you here in 2025, too! Hugs.
Keep going Barbara A., we need you! 💙 Blessings for your amazing doctors - and to you for your will.
Good tidings to you, and thank you for your spunk and determination! I am proud to be your countryman. I wish you many comfortable days, and I hope you're around to see the orange traitor go to prison where he belongs!
I am so grateful to everyone who "liked" my comment, and to those who replied. I've been on this substack situation since late November and am so pleased i have a place to voice what i feel. This 2024 is going to be full of ups and downs for those of us who don't want Donald anywhere near our presidency. Thanks to Mary, Joyce and E.Jean for giving us their perspectives, and encouraging us to voice our own. I don't operate a substack myself -- in fact it took me a couple of weeks to even figure out what one is! Bless you all and full steam ahead!
Joyce, wishing you and your loved ones (furry, feathered and otherwise) a healthy, happy new year! It remains an important fact that people as honest, intelligent, kind, brave and strong as you, are visible and continuing to tell the truth about what is going on in American politics and the danger the Republican party represents to our precious democracy. Thank you very much for who you are and what you do. And with apologies to Alabama fans, Go Blue!
I'm with you, CC❣️
Democracy is on the line folks! Please do everything in your power to get out the vote and to encourage 18 to 29s to register and vote. We are depending on you as www.TurnUp.US, Zev Shapiro and I will be working very hard every single day to accomplish that result as well.
Happy New Year Ira and thank you for all that you do 💙 I joined TurnUp and sent to my millennial and Gen Z children and godchildren.
Many many thanks; they are excellent and effective!!well worth it if everyone would go to www.TurnUp.US and generously contribute plus spread the word to your friends and family!
Makes ne ill reading about trump constantly. What an evil person
Absolutely agree; it is truly sickening. However, we must understand the details so that we can not only understand for ourselves, but be able to explain to those who are either ambivalent, or who are so weary of all of this that they are ignoring the facts and details. It is only through understanding that each of us can come to the truth.
Get used to it.. we will have to suffer with this for 10 more months and a few days in november to see if we get free of this existential menace...unless something unexpected happens..
And much longer!
Let us prey
I’m not sure a stroke would be unexpected.
One good thing that’s come out of the election of Trump in 2016 is that many of us previously “informed consistent voters but not activists” became activists. It started with the Women’s March in Jan 2017 and continues until today. We work very hard to fight for our rights and the good of our country. We’ve also become best friends. People talk about the rift in older friendships “now that we know”. But I’m far more happy about my new ones than I am sad about my old ones. I admit it’s a lot of boomer women. We have the time because we’re retired, and we especially value the men and young people who help us do big things. We’ve flipped congressional seats, our county now has more Democrats than Republicans, we finally got our board of supervisors working well, and we’re working on our school boards (win some, lose some). We raise our voices, carry signs, we organize, hold debates, register voters, make big and small donations, organize volunteers, knock on doors, text voters, help other states, write postcards, and do phonebanking. But our favorite is to wave signs over the 405 fwy so all the people stuck in traffic see us waving giant signs and encouraging them to honk for individual candidates. This is going to help us in 2024. We need to get the truth out about whose fault the price of hamburger really is. We will. It’s not Joe Biden’s fault and Republicans have no plan to address it anyway.
Yes we boomers are in it to win but I want to give much credit to the African American women who turn out the votes in every election. They educate and preach to their neighbors, families, and friends about getting to the polls or to be assisted to getting there. Their work is to be commended and if the Democratic Party doesn’t come through, then we all lose. That’s a fact.
So true, and something I point out all the time to help keep spirits up and all of us energized. There are millions more people now than in 2015 who are showing high levels of civic engagement. Even though I've been active in electoral politics and nonviolent civil disobedience and direct action for social and environmental justice, for some 45 years, I myself have seen my own civics knowledge skyrocket through reading HCR and Joyce Vance and Robert Hubbell and Jay Kuo. And I, like millions, have been doing phone banking and letter writing and other get out the vote work that I never did before. This is what a democracy looks like!
Hi Eric, a point, but I hope not received as trivia is that 45% of eligible voters in 2024 will be Millenial and Gen Zs. And many of them are first time voters - most will be for Biden (against Trump). I love these young folks, who have BS detectors a mile high. The can tell whom they can trust in a nano-second. We Blue's should not be so arrogant to think that they approve the Democrat Party agenda carte blanche because they do not. They just detest Trump. And if we hope to have them join 'us' (I personally do), we need to show them something of value. Otherwise, they will form their own party. I love their honesty and intelligence. They are smart enough to not split their votes, but 'warning' because they are not taken in by anything the Democrats have to offer. They just want to do everything they can to dismiss Trump permanently. We cannot relax and rest with that - we need to do everything possible to defeat Trump - as you have recommended, with phone-banking and letter writing, etc.
GenZ’ers are truly our hope. Don’t know if anyone follows Victor Shi or David Hogg but they both have hundreds of thousands of followers. Hogg and the wonderful Maxwell Frost plus Shi do an amazing job keeping people up-to-date on things people should care about.
Thank you Marlene! Indeed, I will check out Victor Shi and David Hogg. I adore the late born millennial, who are almost Gen Z - just on the edge, a couple of years, older and can mentor them. I’ve always said the Gen Z should’ve come with a warning label on them :-) they simply have the kind of detector that cuts through everything. I respect them so because of the way they’ve handled what they have inherited. And we need to really think about this precious generation, because we collectively have not made good decisions about the environment or anything else that impacts them. They are lovely to work with:))
We must engage them to look at the bigger picture as many are outraged over what they see as Biden’s neglect in Gaza and continued support of Israel. They can’t get beyond it to see that no vote or a third party vote or a vote for trump is much, much worse.
I love what you are doing Eric. Having a positive critical mass is so important. We are in this together because of Joyce’s leadership. But as well, we are supporting one another and learning from other Substack members. For example, I have been given terrific referrals to books and movies (The movie 'Unfit,' that I had not seen; most effective groups for postcard writing campaigns:)
This is quite a diversion and perhaps too gay , but I came across this poem to tonight and with all the crap going on and hate against all I thought a good way to end the year in Ecuador is the wise words of Walt Whitman ... a pioneer from my town of birth
From the Calamus Poems by Walt Whitman (1891-1892)
THIS MOMENT YEARNING AND THOUGHTFUL. THIS moment yearning and thoughtful sitting alone, It seems to me there are other men in other lands yearning and
thoughtful, It seems to me I can look over and behold them in Germany,
Italy, France, Spain, Or far, far away, in China, or in Russia or Japan, talking other
dialects, And it seems to me if I could know those men I should become attached to them as I do to men in my own lands, 0I know we should be brethren and lovers,
I know I should be happy with them.
Hi Mike, Walt Whitman is not 'too gay.' It should not matter whether gay or not, but my now deceased husband and I (we are/were heterosexual) both loved Whitman and used to take turns reading his poems to one another: he is for everyone, so thank you for sharing him with us tonight. Thank you so much for giving us this reminder tonight that 'we are all in this together.' For me the most fitting example is his 'Song of Myself.' I hope you are having the happiest of New Years 💙
FOURTEEN AMENDMENT: Much of the debate on this seems to quietly accept that we needn’t or that it wouldn’t be prudent to follow the law because it would be disruptive, because Trump voters would be outraged, because “the voters should decide.”
Just another way to say Trump’s above the law.
If you just follow the constitution, it seems obvious there was an attempt through violence to substitute someone for the person elected -- an insurrection -- and that Trump deliberately launched it.
The general doesn’t usually follow the troops into battle. Trump didn’t. But everyone knows it was Trump’s insurrection , ax both congressional leaders of his own party said at the time. That he watched it for hours without restraining them proves they were doing his biding.
Whether Trump is on the ballot or not, one way or the other, tens of millions of Americans will be outraged. Let’s ignore that and follow the law. Of course, the black-robed GOP agents on the Supreme Court aren’t likely to do that.
My New Year’s resolution: Repeat for everyone to please write in hard copy, in email, on social media; plead with President Biden to commence a fireside chat with the nation along the lines of FDR. Biden is clearly losing the PR on his administration. No mater how effective he can be but limited given the ferocity of partisan politics, to be effective. We need to hear him. The undecided need to hear him. Progressives need to hear him. Moderate republicans needs to hear him. Biden needs to humanize himself.
So let’s all make a commitment to repeat this request of Biden over and over and over again. He is clearly losing the PR war and I don’t think he understands it from his vantage.
Please let’s get this message out. We want President Biden to begin his Fireside Chats.
Hillary Clinton made election-losing assumptions, and therefore fatal campaign mis-steps in a race she should not have lost. Al Gore was pretty wooden as well - and should have won easily. I trust Joe Biden doesn't go down the same Democratic lukewarm path ... he already has several strikes against him, and some pretty lousy polling numbers.
Fireside Chats would be a good thing.
I agree with everything you just mention. However, it was Bill Clinton’s need to get BJs from an intern that cast a pall over Gore’s chances besides him being uptight.
Gore was presented as ‘uptight’ because of idiots like Maureen Dowd who criticized his ‘earth-toned’ garb.
I sensed that he was going to be one of the great presidents of out time. Instead we bought an idiot that led us into unnecessary wars and equally horrible, regressive worthless Supreme Court justices.
The Al Gore we missed as president has shown his character in the environmental advocacy has has pursued ever since.
Happy, safe, healthy New Year 2024. Thank you for not only the legal expertise, but also Tofu and the chickens.
Happy New Year Joyce!! I’m am truly grateful for your commitment to the ‘cause’ here, and your exceptionally informative messages. And selfishly speaking...I need more Omletta! The BEST name ever for a chicken ! 😊 a genius name... take care
Hi Joyce,
In Michigan, the ballot allowance for Trump is solely for the primary at this point. If he wins that stage, we all expect an immediate lawsuit to ban him from the general presidential ballot. Stay tuned!
Happy New Year and ... GO BLUE!!! 😉
Yes Sheila, and Go Blue!
Thank you, counselor. You make a huge difference in the world, honesty and clarity and the truth. It will keep us or set us free happy new year don’t stop.
Happy New Year, Joyce! Wishing you and your family a wonderful 2024! Thank you for all you do to keep us informed. Reading your Substack helps keep me sane in these crazy times brought on by tfg and those who continue to support his antics. Looking forward to lots of critter pictures in the new year! All so very cute! 💙