398 Comments
May 22Liked by Joyce Vance

A brilliant article, Joyce. Thank you. As more and more comments relate our Trumpian nightmare to Nazi Germany, please remind everyone that Hitler accomplished his agenda with the total complicity of his judges, without which he would have been powerless. That parallel to us today is horrifying and deadly serious.

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Thanks you and yes, I agree.

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In this case, the judges may be SCOTUS!

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Precisely. SCOTUS is essential for the authoritarian take-over to succeed, But their accomplices have spread throughout the Republican dominated state courts and federal appeals courts. Given the fact that this problem didn't fade away years ago shows how serious and vital the fascist threat is.

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Write a complaint about a Judge Cannon, who is not doing her job.

- Here is how to get a form. Go to uscourts.gov

- At the bottom of the page find: Judges & Judgeships

- Choose: Judicial Conduct & Disability

- On the left find: Filling a Judicial Conduct or Disability Complaint Against A Federal Judge.

- In the document, choose #4: How do I file my complaint?

- Within the page, choose: the form Download and print it.

- Information you will need as you complete the form:

1. Your name, address, and contact phone number.

2. Name of Judge: Aileen Cannon

Court: U.S. District Court for the District of Florida

3. Complaint is about behavior? YES

If YES then: Court: U.S. District Court for the District of Florida

Case Number: 23-80101-CR-Cannon

Disregard the appeal number and circuit.

- You are not a Party or Lawyer, you are: Neither.

4. Brief Statement of Facts: read about the case and Cannons handling of it and write what you want to.

Read the declaration and sign and date the form and mail it to:

The Clerk of the US Court of Appeals

For the Eleventh District

Elbert P. Tuttle Courthouse

56 Forsyth Street, NW

Atlanta, GA 30303

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This is great! However I do not hold out much hope for this avenue of justice for her. Hoping that the NPR investigative reporters are able to unearth something scandalous about her.

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It's not at the bottom of the homepage anymore. Click on the MENU link, upper left, choose Judges & Judgeships, then choose Judicial Conduct & Disability. On this page, go down to Court Resources and choose 11th Circuit. At the end of the paragraphs under Judicial Conduct & Disability, there's a pdf link to the complaint form.

Or go directly to https://www.ca11.uscourts.gov/judicial-conduct-disability

There also is, below the Complaint Form link, a link to FAQs on filing a complaint against a federal judge. Naturally, it's complicated but Gail Talbot has provided the address to which the complaint must be submitted so perhaps you can skip all of the faqs.

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Thanks, Judith! That's going to be the first thing on my to-do list tomorrow.

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Thanks, Gail! It never occurred to me that we'd ever have an opportunity to formally complain about her. I appreciate your sharing this with us. I keep thinking it will be an exercise in futility, but we have no choice, since we can't afford for this scumbag to ever get within 10 miles of the White House again.

Speaking of the White House, if --- Heaven help us --- he should be re-elected, I wouldn't be at all surprised to learn that he'd be relocating the White House, and what's left of the Government, down to the Mar-A-Lago area.

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Perhaps we could call it the Pink-a-Lago. :)

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Somehow, that wouldn't surprise me. I'm sure his neighbors would love that. (Being sarcastic, just a tad.)

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May 23·edited May 23

It's a 2-page document. At the top of each page, it says "Judicial Council of the__________________Circuit" What number is the Circuit?

I'm really at a loss for what to write. I want to say that she schedules hearings to decide when to have a hearing. But that is too narrow, I think, and I'm sure there's a better wording than she's holding things up so that the case cannot be resolved before the election. If Jack Smith can't say that, then it doesn't seem like I should. Could somebody make a brief suggestion, please. I will change the wording slightly so that it doesn't sound like I'm just being a copy cat.

Thank you!!!

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Cannon serves in the 11th Circuit.

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founding

Let's not forget the corruption of Aileen Cannon, who has successfully halted the classified documents case. This will become the norm rather than the exception under a future Trump administration.

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I wish I could be brief discussing this topic and Judge Cannon. I would first draw your attention to the best written chronology of the Nazis, "The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich", by William L. Shirer. The first 200 pages of the 1000 page plus tome is all about the organization of the Nazis. I would point out on pages 121 and 122 and cite.. "No other party in Germany came near to attracting so many shady characters. (pg. 122) As we have seen a conglomeration of pimps, murderers, homosexuals, alcoholics, and blackmailers, flocked to the party as if to a mutual haven. Hitler did not care as long as they were useful to him." "This fine judicial triumvirate performed to the complete satisfaction of the Fuehrer. A party leader might be accused of the most nefarious crime. Buch's answer invariably was, 'Well what of it?' What he wanted to know was whether it hurt party discipline or offended the Fuehrer."

Donald Trump is not going to be president, I don't care what the MSNBC pundits ascribe to. He could die from a heart attack, he has managed to irritate and irk every veteran, including this one with his insults, and our families and survivors of every war for the past century. He has irritated every parent and the families of children killed in school attacks, he and his party have antagonized every woman, and their families with his boasting and bragging about over turning Roe, he and his party have engaged in what could only be described as state sanctioned reckless endangerment with their birth control and pregnancies and prison and death threats. Trump and his sycophants and allies have threated the rule of law in just about every state and jurisdiction in the country and yet not one arrest by any law enforcement agency in any state. The Republicans are the party of death, period. The death of the rule of law, the death of state governments, the pillars of our federal system, the death of our form of government, the death of senior citizens, who are no longer useful, I am 75 and I could still kick Trump's ass all over the lot except that the fools that we are, we are paying for an army of protection for Trump and his cronies who want to overthrow our government by force.

But there is still a lot of time until November, and Trump has a big mouth and he may piss of a few more people, including the CIA and DOJ who will not want him get to the presidency. Not to mention foreign governments. They all have a way of making people disappear. You never know. It's early yet.

No one is asking some of the questions of Judge Cannon, like exactly where are the classified documents, EXACTLY. Does she have them? Does she control them? She has had several ex parte conferences with the Trump defendants counsel. Is DOJ investigating her as an accomplice? Did she or has she shared classified material with staff, who has control of the copies of the material in whatever format,. thumb drives, CDs etc.? Is it okay with the DOJ that lives in foreign countries may be at stake? Is it okay with the democrats in the congress that there is no definitive response about this Judge that she is not being investigated? Why have no democrats or police officer filed criminal complaints against Republican members of Congress who participated in the Jan 6 riot.

I am meeting with my member of congress tomorrow and will ask all of these questions.

Saving lives and influencing destiny one day at a time.

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I think your post is excellent, Karl. Thanks for taking the time to write it.

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founding

May be?

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founding

From “Freedom and Government” an essay by Bertrand Russell

The first step in a fascist movement is the combination under an energetic leader of a number of men who possess more than the average share of leisure, brutality, and stupidity.

The next step is to fascinate fools and muzzle the intelligent, by emotional excitement on the one hand and terrorism on the other.

https://quoteinvestigator.com/2024/02/28/fools-muzzle/

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Sadly so.

How did we become so complacent?

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founding

I don't know, lassitude probably. More importantly, how do we wake the voters from their somnambulism?

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Lack of education. When I heard that civics was no longer taught in schools I realized that was the beginning. Citizens who have no idea about their government become pawns to fascistic people. Some of our elected representative can't even list the three branches of government!! This has got to be remedied if we're to remain a democracy.

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Well, I am one who believes that Trump is a good thing if only to test our system of gubmint. Perhaps I am naive? I thought Nixon and dubya were a good test. We survived but still have a way to go to awaken those who still resist the call to participate.

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Correct, and fascism if far more frightening than communism could ever be. With the possible exception of Bezos, Musk and that ilk, who tremble in fear of having to share their ill-gotten gains with (horrors!!!) common people. They cheer the idea of fascism which puts industrialists at the peak of society.

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May 22·edited May 22

Well said. Actually, communism becomes in practice a form of fascism; it has zero chance of achieving its irrational idealism and devolves into concentrated tyrannical power (authoritarianism), which is the issue. Musk and Friends (Federalist Societry tycoons and affiliated oligarchs and their wholly owned politicians and judges) think that all that money that trickles up to them belongs to them. It is the people's money even when the people let them hold on to it for a while. That's why they must destroy democracy.

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Isn’t it interesting how unregulated capitalism ends up in the same place as devolved communism?

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So true. Both lose all resistance to lies and corruption. There's a reason that our capitalist fascists get along with dictators, 'communist' or otherwise. None of them could exist in a transparent democracy in which individual ownership and common ownership function as one coordinated, equitable, sane system. I look back in amazement at FDR's miracle, now lost.

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May 22·edited May 22

Governing will always be a dirty business under any form of eternally progressive profit motivated wealth extraction system. Communism and Capitalism are simply two sides of the same coin.

Stalin had Beria and FDR had J Edgar Hoover. Neither of them would have been able to wield power or introduce their social revolutions without such individuals working in the shadowlands using corrupt practices to fight other corrupt players. We need to think ourselves up an entirely new social paradigm or self extinction is all but assured.

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That is a false equivalency. The only way to root out corruption, which occurs in every system, is through transparent, democratic, rule of law. Preventing the rich and powerful from rigging the system to impede the correction of errors takes a lot of time and political will. Regulation of capitalism is the issue, not the elimination of profits. Wealth hoarding is the problem, not money itself.

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Fay, and industrialists of any kind do not belong at the top of anything except perhaps, their own business. Mixing politics and industry is never a good idea. Fascism is far more destructive than Communism which is why so many "Communists" have become fascists: Putin, Xi, Orban, and Kim for example. We do not need either form here but Fascism is by far the worst.

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Precisely why the acceptance of 'gratuities' by Alito and Thomas, and any Judge for that matter, are so outrageous and need to be prohibited in total, or punished if necessary, by removal from the bench.

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I agree on fascism, Ruth but not communism. As laid out by Plato - communism was a government organization with a chosen group of selfless, leaders who benevolently guided the people in the commune to the very best of communal living. Everyone worked at something they loved doing. And, everyone contributed all the fruits of that labor to the commune itself. Those products were then distributed to everyone according to their needs. No one took more than their share. If the commune were attacked everyone in the commune defended it.

As I said this can only work in very small groups of like minded individuals Where are you going to find anywhere a group of 100 or even fewer, individuals and NO greed. Even in a small family related by marriage and birth it is not unusual to find at least one sibling greedier than the others.

Perhaps in 1917, Lenin or Trotsky may have aspired to Communism, but I certainly find no evidence of that. In October 2018 they murdered he Romanov family, in order to assure there would be no royalists to rally around.

Lenin died and was succeeded by Stalin an authoritarian dictator. All the Russian people achieved was to replace one group of vicious aristocratic authoritarians with a group of common authoritarians.

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Fay, isn't it sad that a great idea as Communism was in its infancy and within a small group could be morphed into something so destructive: Stalin's Soviet Union, Mao's China, and Kim's North Korea. Countless millions were killed in the name of Communism and the current residents of those countries are trying to revive these murderers as heroes, when they were murdering bullies in reality.

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Yes, Ruth, it is sad. But it is also sad that people like the oligarchs behind this whole rush to fascism can use fear of "communism", which has never existed to make ordinary Americans accept a demented lowlife, like the trumpster as their (puppet) dictator for life to throw us all into the fascism that existed from WW1 through WW2.

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Until an authoritarian is elected and he decides he wants to take possession of..whatever he wants. All are going to be surprised at how quickly they are thrown away.

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You are absolutely correct, and by then it is impossible to change short of outright war/

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Judge Cannon will lead the way…

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Susan, don't you just love the way vulnerable women or women who are inept and incompetent (Cannon) are recruited by Republicans and the national misogynists to do harm to the nation in general and women in particular. Justice Barrett is also one of those in the judiciary, but Greene, Boebert, Conway, and Stephanik are among those who bow and scrape to Trump and Kump for the power and financial crumbs the guys will toss their way. The Germans of Nazi times did the same to women and used them in so many ways often against other women. We need to call them out more regularly if we women are to survive this period of Republican insanity.

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Just like the female guards at the camps...during WWII.

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Years ago I heard a podcast about the origins of fascism. One of the first steps was to take away power from women in the form of stripping them of their reproductive rights and conning them into believing their role in the new world order was to have babies. Thus removing them from any form of power. Good thing it doesn't apply to those of us who no longer worry about reproduction for ourselves...

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Amanda, we are fortunate, those of us beyond child-bearing years, but we have daughters, nieces, grands, and other young women who face the male-driven, power-inspired insanity. How dare a bunch of ignorant mostly rich white folks take away our rights so we have fewer than our mothers had. We women need to stand with and for the generations after us! We must do it until we drive those closed-minded, power hungry, greedy toddler-men and the women who slave for them, out of power.

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You are my people! I have a son and daughter, nieces and nephews. I spent a lifetime defending everyone's Constitutional rights, I'll be damned if I'm going to sit back and allow anyone be turned into property.

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Amanda, Amen and Amen!! Our children, and all children are our children deserve better than what Republicans have planned for them. We need to send the toddler-men now in charge packing and start demanding that they begin acting like responsible adults for a change. We women want to be neither their slaves nor their mommies.

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And here we are, women still outnumber the men, yet we don’t wield the power to protect ourselves, protect our children and protect society.

What is the matter with us??

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A, I am not an historian of gender, but I suspect a lot of what happened over time is men's physical size being larger, women being tied down with pregnancies they couldn't control or limit for the most part, and tradition. Those factors kept women doing the bulk of the work of the family and it became "the way it has always been done." That is a powerful social control which is usually enforced whenever major change is imminent. We saw that with the Civil Rights movement, women's rights, and LGBTQ+ rights. Let's face it, white men are scared. They have always been a minority, so have had to use power, physical strength, rape, a loud voice, and their other male traits to put everyone else down and we all, trying to survive, went along with it. I honor the women who stood up to those men, most of whom had no children and/or had help from other women to raise them. What I am sure of is that "leaning in" is never going to work permanently. We need to sit at the decision-making tables on the same kind of chairs the men have and have the same right to speak and be heard without constant interruption. We need men to stop making decisions about women's bodies and lives as though they are in charge of us; they should not be. Then, we women and our non-woman allies need to stop voting for misogynistic men no matter what they call themselves. Who cares what letter is behind their name if they want to keep women and non-white males down. They don't deserve anyone's vote. We could fix this if we could shake people, mostly white women out of the stupor they have been in and show them reality. It might wake a few and that might be enough.

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2,000 years of misogyny, that's what.

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I honestly think it's going to take a violent revolution, where women in this country band together and literally take over.

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Actually, Ruth, it makes me sick, and it makes me feel crazy. To me there's something wrong with turning against your own kind. Even though I never had children, and don't understand what it's like to be a mother, I find that my heart goes out to the women I've seen who are devastated by all the cruelty. I guess I will never understand the call of power. Maybe it's their cure for incompetence?

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Susan, I too have no children, but have friends and family who do and deserve to be treated like the amazing intelligent, bodily autonomous people they are and should be. For millennia, we women have been cowed by men forced to not only do their bidding, but to tolerate their violence, their playing around, and general abuse. We now have positions of authority in many places in this country and beyond and need to act. We still deal with nations that have determined their women are irrelevant except as mommies and playthings for the men (OK, they are permanent mommies for the men too who never have to really grow up). The men claim it is some kind of biology that determines that they should rule, but there is no biology in it, just violence and created fear. We need to wake the MAGA women up, if we can, to see they are just tools of the MAGA men and no matter how much they bluster, whine, make up stuff for their men (Greene and her ilk), they will never have respect from their toddler-men. If they get any power, those men will drive them down, blackmail them, disparage them, etc. to get them back in their place, beneath even the most disgusting among the MAGA men. How is it we women don't see what is really going on that has allowed ourselves to be groomed to believe the nonsense and do harm to other women over the generations. It is women who perform female genital mutilation in most places, women who reported women to authorities in witch hunts, women who now do Trump's bidding and just can't/won't believe Trump is an ignorant misogynist so work with him to take away women's rights. women who kept the churches going even though they had no real power within the church. We all need to find ways to break out of this mass insanity into a better world before men and their female surrogates take us all down. We must remember, women are the majority.

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Unfortunately, the MAGA women are beyond hope. What I'm seeing, that absolutely horrifies me is, many women, especially young women, tune out what's going on around them and instead busy themselves with social media popularity and fame. It's just sickening to watch these shallow, attention seeking females ignore that their rights are being taken away and they're doing nothing to stop it. They're not even talking about it among themselves. WHY?!?

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Megan, and it is the mostly rich white men who run social media who have captured these women and are dragging them down as far as they can. Where are the talented Tik-Tokers and You Tubers who can present these women with a different picture and let them see what is being done to them and that they are being used to keep rich white men in power? Then, there are the males, obsessed with video games soaked in blood and betrayal that let them think that is how the world works and that they can do to women whatever they want if they are in a "war" and have the power (and they are always in a war). I know all young people are not wrapped up in this insanity, but enough are that it is concerning and I worry that civility is taking a bigger hit than it has in a long time.

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Ruth, I couldn't agree with you more. I think the problem is that women, in general, by nature, are stronger (and smarter) than men, which drives men crazy, and violence and put downs are the only way they can figure out to control us. I'm grateful that all men are not that way. I also think that women have been brought up in a way that has them believing that they should be subservient to men. I know I was, because my father essentially told me and my sisters that we would never make it through life without a husband. Fortunately, it IS possible to grow beyond that. And to survive and do well without a husband. I did finally get married at age 63, when I met someone worth marrying, and before that I was taking care of myself just fine. I think a lot of women have been programed much deeper than I was.

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Susan, I am grateful I had role models in my life of women who were not married, didn't have children, and a father that encouraged my mother to work since she wanted to. My siblings and I are all quite different in our approaches to marriage and children. My older sister is married no kids, I am neither married nor have kids. My next younger sister married 4 times and could have no kids. My next younger sister is married more than 40 years and has 3 kids and 3 grands. My younger sister did not marry but has 2 kids and 7 grands. I like the variety because it proves women should not be boxed into something they don't want or can't manage. I have been very lucky to have really good men in my life. Maybe the not-so-good men realized I would not permit them to abuse or put me down without comment and stayed away. Maybe that's what more women and girls need to learn to project. That will be a challenge, but we can model and teach it if the will is there.

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Good point Susan. She is an aberration. Or is abomination?

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Joe is fighting back effectively; 198 new Democratic federal judges have appointed and approved by our very narrow majority in the Senate including AZ and WV!

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You're both being too nice. As far as I'm concerned, she's an "abdomination," because she makes me sick to my stomach.

(Sorry, but I thought this scary subject needed something on the light side, to keep me from getting bummed out.)

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founding

I wish the press would find another photo of her. Those Charlie Manson eyes are as scarry as that pure evil stare of Matt Gaetz.

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Hmmm. I thought that I was the only one who gets creeped out by her face. It's the kind that would stop a clock!

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An abomination, unfortunately.

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Both.

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Yes, that's why the five men on the Supreme Court are so scary. They are being well taken care of for their loyalty to the party. The other trim is that NOTHING is being done about them! Dick Durban seems to have forgotten that the Senate Judicial Committee has a responsibility. Has he been paid off or just intimidated. It is beginning to feel as if everyone except the folks in NY, have already been paid off --the courts, the press, politicians, police, big business, big oil, big agriculture, fundamentalist Christians, all want no restrictions on themselves but lots on everyone else. I hope elections will matter.

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Unfortunately, Dick Durbin is literally powerless to do anything about our highest court's ethical standards. Our SCOTUS wields way too much power and at this point they're untouchable. They are the ones who control their own behavior, much like Congress. It takes 2/3 approval of Congress to enact term limits and impeach a SCOTUS judge. They're never going to vote themselves out of these cushy, influential jobs, nor are they going to impeach justices who are working in lockstep to further their "conservative" agenda. It's very hard not to lose hope at this point, but we must continue to fight these fascists or we lose everything.

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I disagree but perhaps you can explain more what you mean. The way I see it Hitler would not have been powerless without his judges. He only allowed people to be judges who would do his bidding, after killing off his most obvious opposition in the beginning without any trials. In fact, my daughter is having a test on this tomorrow at University in Germany, so we have been discussing this. It has made me acutely aware of how many parallels there are to Hitler's Germany and what Trump wants to accomplish, with the agreement of a lot of the American population. I am losing my sense that American democracy can totally protect us from this, even though we have had Democracy much longer than Germany did when Hitler came to power. They had only had 15 years of democracy, and before that they had an Absolutist monarch. Kaiser Wilhelm II was forced to abdicate the throne and fled the country after Germany lost WWI. Up until then Germany had had either principalities, or dukedoms, or a single monarch for hundreds of years, since before it was Germany. Germany was largely Prussia, before it became a consolidated Empire in 1871.

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Yes, I shouldn't have said 'powerless', although I think I was partially right if the judges had recognized human rights from the start. That probably wouldn't have prevented the Night of the Long Knives, just as MAGA is now getting away with an insurrection. Your elucidation of the transition from the Weimar Republic to Nazi Terror and your warning to us today is vitally important. I hope your daughter does well on her exam today; I'm sure she will.

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Yes, the Night of the Long Knives supposedly killed off a lot of the communists, as well as some of Hitler's supposed friends that he was afraid were getting too much power. That is another parallel that I see to Trump with his list of enemies like Hitler had, and also this constant harping on the communists. As far as I can see the Left poses far less threat to any nation than the right, but then the Left Represents the concept of unionization which apparently terrifies the corporate owners, and leaders. They backed Hitler getting into power just as the Heritage Society represents titans of industry in our modern day context, and wants to destroy the quality of life of anyone else. One thing that is strongly different in Germany of today, is that people expect their government to take care of them in ways that the US citizenry does not seem to expect. Child care, child monies, tuition free university education, health care, etc... I wish all of this for the USA, as as well as the rights that are being taken away like abortion, women's health care, trans rights, gay rights, people's rights. I am also shocked at how Abbott has gotten away with murdering immigrants. I see that as fitting into Trump's plans to exterminate people. Look at how the transportation of undesirables was done in Germany, and then look at the way that "Immigrants are being made undesirable." That is a total White Supremacist agenda. Thank you for your wishes for my daughter. She has it tomorrow morning, so it will probably be over by the time people in the US are waking up thanks to the 6-8 hour time difference. I think she will be well prepared, and I have had a history refresher in the meantime.

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Which is why 'Lennie and the Federalists' have been vetting and salting their hand-picked goons--er, "judges"--anywhere they can do so.

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I re-read 1984 this year as well. Haven't read Hand Maid's tale...yet. Thank you for the information and source to 'not believing your eyes and ears'...I repeat that one quite often as well, now I have a source.

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It seems like nobody gets this, that “deny, distort, distract” is the GOP strategy. What really surprises me is 1) the GOP is so mean and hateful and 2) they don’t have any sense of levity or humor where they can laugh at themselves. Does not exist. All about power, glamor, privilege and control.

Thanks Joyce

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You ever met a Fundamentalist moron who could laugh at himself? These people are worse than Cotton Mather and the lunatic "Mayflower Founders" who got chased out of 17th Century Netherlands for their extremism, their idea of "religious freedom" being their "freedom" to harass and attack anyone who disagreed with their crazy version of "christianity." This country's crazy attitude about religion goes back to the beginning. It's too bad the leaky old Mayflower didn't founder mid-Atlantic. This country would be a better place without those genocidal theocrats being the "founding faters."

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I've been reading "A People's History of the United States" by Howard Zinn. I must concur with you that the sinking of the Mayflower may have been one of the best things that could have happened to the land. (I am a direct descendent of Roger Williams. Reading Zinn's book makes me relieved to have him as my ancestor, not a monster like Cotton Mather.)

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I’ve just read *Saints and Strangers*, a book by George F Willison published in 1945 by Reynal & Hitchcock, New York.

Its full title is Saints and Strangers - Being the Lives of the Pilgrim Fathers & Their Families, with Their Friends & Foes: & and Account of Their Posthumous Wanderings in Limbo, Their Final Resurrection & Rise to Glory, & the Strange Pilgrimages of Plymouth Rock. It’s well documented, drawing in part from the writings of these people from the time of their leaving England, through their sojourn in the Netherlands, and on to their first couple of hundred years in America. Willison had a nice readable style, with occasional bits of humour, but he does not leave the impression that these were likeable people! The book gave me a perspective on what I’m seeing in America today. TCinLA and kdsherpa are exactly right!

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I think we could be also be reading books on Hitler's rise to power and the Nazi regime to have a more current picture of what we are looking at right now with Trump, and his Billionaire and Millionaire fundamentalist backers, who want to take the US right back to the Middle Ages. There are a lot of parallels to Hitler's agenda and his way of maintaining things. The fact that he says if Biden were Republican he would be sentenced to death, means to me he plans to bring back the death penalty and convict people of treason, if he even bothers to do this sort of kangaroo court stuff, instead of just executing them. I believe both Biden and Harris are in danger of execution in cold blood by a Trump regime. So, are many other people. Robert Hubbell put it plainly in his Substack here. If you scroll down to the section that says, Life Under Biden vs. Trump 2025.

https://roberthubbell.substack.com/p/but-the-price-of-groceries

It is very, very concerning. The fact that Trump is speaking about a Reich is very very concerning. Scroll down to the third paragraph of Heather Cox Richardson's Substack here. https://heathercoxrichardson.substack.com/p/may-20-2024

Trump is spelling out how he wants to follow in Hitlers footsteps. "Immigrants" are the modern day Jews. Everyone who opposes him are the communists and radicals that Hitler got rid of right in the beginning, along with people who were disabled in any way physically or mentally. We are looking at the most dangerous man in American history to date in Donald Trump.

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He is literally parroting Hitler's playbook, and still Americans can't figure out what he's planning. It's written in Project 2025 and he and cronies talk about it daily. And yet, apparently a majority of Americans still say they will vote for him. We certainly can't say we werent' warned what he had in mind for Round 2.

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Marvelous comment!

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Or Oliver Cromwell.

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Cromwell's Parliamentary Republic ended after 11 years, and the Monarchy came back into power. Cromwell died in 1658 and two years later the Monarchy was restored by popular demand because of the chaos that ensued after Cromwell died.

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Well, TC, for once I agree 100% with you. It may sound like an extreme statement, but it is the absolute truth.

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Strange things happen in the Trump Daze. :-)

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TC, I agree that the Pilgrims and Puritans who came over here were closed-minded, but they did evolve and became some of the strongest supporters of American independence and most ardent abolitionists. Today the spiritual descendants of those Pilgrim/Puritans are the United Church of Christ, one of the most progressive denominations with programs to serve communities here and around the world. Religion can be warped by anyone who wants power and prestige they do not deserve. Evangelicals right now are the religion-warpers because they have no established denomination, just a bunch of folks floundering, trying to figure out which of the worst passages in the bible are the ones they will cling to and try to force on everyone else. People with such restrictive views and lack of concern for the first amendment of our Constitution spring up regularly. Those of us not involved with those groups need to find ways to keep them from gaining so much power they put all of our lives at risk.

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You are correct that Evangelicals always find the worst passages in the Bible to cling to & try to force on everyone else. But the strangest thing to me has been that they are always quoting from the Old Testament - and are particularly fond of the passages featuring the smiting of those they hate. I rarely see any passages from the New Testament, & especially missing are any passages from Christ's Sermon on the Mount in Matthew 5. Too much love & forgiveness there, I guess. Not enough smiting.

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KMD, you are sooo right! As a UCC minister, I use the Common Lectionary for preparing worship services and sermons and I have chosen to only marginally include Old Testament readings that are about smiting and hating. I know those were realities for humans and still are, but I don't have to put more of that into the world as though saying it was OK then and well, maybe might be OK now if the hatred were turned on the "right" people. I want to believe we humans have grown quite a lot in the past 2,000+ years. Targeting people for one's hatred is just wrong no matter who is doing it. It seems, though people or rather, some people like to feel superior to others and scrounging for biblical passages that let them believe they are superior works well for them and is very difficult to counter. Without that, they might be just average like everyone else. Their egos won't permit that, and they are sure their god won't permit that either. Forcing others to act in ways they think are acceptable lets them think they are more special to god than anyone else is. I suspect that is why our Supreme Court conservative Catholics jumped on board with letting haters in the name of god deny services to LGBTQ+ persons, even when there was actually no case involved. They got themselves some points with their god. That is what I call warping religion and we have a lot of that going on at this time. Putting religious fanatics in power is always a mistake unless they are fanatical about securing human rights, equality for all, caring for people in need, ending war, stopping legislators from passing laws that do deliberate harm, etc.

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“Taking Christ’s teaching out of context, emphasizing punishment and exclusion instead of focusing on empathy and humanity”

I found this description in a little known pamphlet titled “The Birth of Gilead”

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As someone who found the Congregational Church the least-objectionable place to spend the mandatory Sunday morning in a Church back in my yoot', you are right. However, they were also responsible for the first act of European-orchestrated genocide in North America (exclusive of the Spanish-orchestrated genocides in Mexico and countries south), aka "King Philip's War," in which 80% of the Native Americans in New England were wiped out.

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TC, you are right about the events of the 17th Century, but the Congregational evolution was pretty profound. I think the devolution of many of the other Christian denominations has been extremely powerful and supported by folks in power, like that 6 of the current justices are Roman Catholics and one more was raised Catholic. The Catholic Church has a knack of turning positives like the Catholic Social Movement into just women's work that men should be in charge of. We are supposed to be a nation of religious freedom, but so many now think it is just for them and their wacko beliefs which should be forced on everyone else.

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You got that right.

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However, everyone was crazy about religion in Europe for hundreds of years. There was the Spanish Inquisition which forced conversion and caused many to flee to the Ottoman Empire and elsewhere in the 1400s. There is the 30 years war in which 8 million died from 1618-1648 fighting for their brand of religion. European monarchs imposed Catholicism on people and Protestants hid their religion, fled or were killed. Look at all of the Protestant Huggenots that fled France under Louis XIV, the so called Sun King. The world has been in tumolt over religious intollerence for centuries, and I cannot see the Pilgrims as standing out from the people of their time. We do know that the Protestants of the Renaissance were all a pretty sober lot, but the Catholics were excessively corrupt. Neither seems appealing to me or appropriate in this day and age. To reintroduce standards of that time period is crazy.

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Interestingly, Holland was - comparatively - a "liberal" state back then, though by today's standards of that term they would be only slightly less-dreadful than the rest. They thought the Pilgrims were crazy. In repressive England, the authorities went after them for their extreme theology. The Pilgrims were in a class of their own, thought by all who came in contact with them to be C-c-c-crayyyyzeeeee!

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Yes. The Netherlands was a series of fiefdoms in the 1400s and a totally different country in the 1500s when Charles of the Hapsburg Dynasty granted the Netherlands to his son Phillip who was King of Spain. The Spanish Netherlands was ruled by the Hapsburgs Spanish branch. That was Catholic. The other branch was the Northern United Provinces, which spoke Dutch and was Protestant. So, a totally different set up and different lands than the modern Netherlands. It was a collection of states ruled by dukes and counts. The relationships back then are not the modern ones, but religion ruled the day. The Enlightenment developed in end of the 1600s and the early 1700s, brought about more religious tolerance in some European monarchies. People who were Jewish or Muslim or other religions were tolerated as well in the Protestant territories. Protestantism evolved out of response to the corruption of the Catholic church which was selling forgiveness of sins to the people who could afford it. The Catholic church was very corrupt. Martin Luther did not plan to leave the church, he just wanted to reform it, and make religion more personal and accessible. I do not think that the Pilgrims stood out for their times religiously. What stood out is the absolute cultural difference they had to the Indigenous Peoples who were here. The Catholics also stood out in difference to the Indigenous Peoples, and have become infamous for their boarding schools.

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Read "Mayflower" by Nathaniel Philbrick. They were worse than the average European religious monsters of the time.

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TCinLA, what is an example of worse than others? My perspective is that they were all awful in their own way. I want to understand what you mean by worse. Currently, living in Germany I am reading German histories right now. Perhaps you could elaborate on what is worse than all other groups, because I have just done revisiting the Nazis and the Holocaust.

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Kim Stanley Robinson wrote a clever book along those ideas, “The Years of Salt and Rice.” The alternative world history has Asia, the Middle East and Iroquois nation bringing Enlightenment to the world, because, in story the Dark Ages of Christian religion never happen because all die from Plague. Not everything is sweetness and light, but, hey, no Mayflower…. Interesting, what if.

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The Iroquois nation's model of democracy inspired the design of America's representative democracy https://www.pbs.org/native-america/blog/how-the-iroquois-great-law-of-peace-shaped-us-democracy

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Smithsonian's National Museum of American Indian has a wonderful exhibit exploring this relationship and, of course, all of the treaties violated by the colonists

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And supposedly inspired the women's suffrage movement.

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I've often thought the world would have been better off if the Black Death had been more thorough.

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founding

Covid WILL mutate. Perhaps there is hope for the earth.

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Oh you're here too. I just subscribed. :)

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TCinLA is *everywhere* :-)

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Saviofaire is everywhere

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Europe has had these same ideas of Religion since the time of the Mayflower, and while they have their fundamentalists they are not taking over all of the EU for example.

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founding

Faters is correct.

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History has a way of avoiding reality unless you dig deep

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This is the Goebbels way of doing things, which is why I call these people the Goebbels Brigade. He was Hitlers Propaganda minister and he told the people how they should think, he gave them false information and told them things were going well when they were not. Having absolute control over the media he was able to trick everyone. One of the problems of the USA is that people are duped all along into thinking that it is the most free country, with the most protection of human rights. I do not believe this is true. It is not more free than many countries in the EU. At the same time, because people buy into this false image they are not able to see the problems our nation has and has had with democracy. That it is okay for people to legislate rights away and be supported by the Supreme court is a problem.

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Why would you be surprised they are so mean and hateful? That is who they are - hateful white men (most of them). As for the power, glamor, privilege and control - there is no glamor to any of them and that includes the females in the bunch. They think they have the rights and privilege to the tell the rest of us what we can and can't do with our bodies, minds and souls. They truly are the worst of US.

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founding

Roe, Roe, Roe the vote!

Christian Nationalist goals are clear:

Legislate from the bench.

Delay delay delay

Steal the election

Establish Gilead

From The Huffington Post and Heather Cox Richardson this Mother’s Day weekend:

Critics Rip Sen. Katie Britt For Celebrating Moms With 'Handmaid's Tale' Like Proposal | HuffPost Latest News

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/katie-britt-moms-federal-pregnancy-database-bill_n_663edfa3e4b0a25325da54c3

HCR’s May 11, Mother’s Day letter is a fine tribute to all four #SistersInLaw!

"Arise, women!” Howe commanded. “Say firmly: ‘We will not have great questions decided by irrelevant agencies. Our husbands shall not come to us, reeking with carnage, for caresses and applause. Our sons shall not be taken from us to unlearn all that we have been able to teach them of charity, mercy and patience. We, women of one country, will be too tender of those of another country, to allow our sons to be trained to injure theirs.’”

https://open.substack.com/pub/heathercoxrichardson/p/may-11-2024?r=5k7fz&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email

Seems every religion’s extreme right shares the same goal: women should be chattel.

Black women in Georgia saved America in 2020. And women will save America in 2024!

Joyce said it best: Roe, Roe, Roe the Vote!

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May 22Liked by Joyce Vance

My invariable answer to the “Right” is TRUST WOMEN. They are unable to do that, and it is damning!

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It's such a good answer!

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And that is what lies at the heart of many state legislatures' refusal to include danger to the woman's health as an exception to their banns on abortion. They don't trust women or their doctors to apply this exception. And this distrust led to ridiculous results in Texas in which hospitals, fearing prosecution, turned away women with emerging dangerous complications, like an intrauterine infections or an enlarging aorta, because the women's conditions were not immediately life threatening. The Texas Supreme Court ultimately decided that MDs and hospitals need not delay until an emerging serious condition became critical. But it took months for that decision to be handed down. During those months, women suffered a loss of fertility due to prolonged uterine infections and others died from complications that could have been averted earlier by ending the pregnancy.

The people driving these draconian laws are zealots in their extremism. And, you are correct, they do not reflect the views of most Americans.

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Elizabeth, and these draconian men do love power. They seem to see women as folks they can control, abuse, even destroy with impunity. For example, women have to prove they have been raped while all the guy has to do is sit in court in a suit and look pathetic. We must get those men out of power or find ways to ignore their pontifications for the sake of ourselves, our daughters, and all women.

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And yet they seem to be in charge...

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Joyce, can you please comment on how doctors have capitulated to these caricatured right wing "law" makers? What happened to the Hippocratic Oath? Can't they say 'fuck you, I'm not going back on the oath I took?" Waiting for a woman's organs to start failing before administrating treatment? Really?? That's as bad as it gets in this country....

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May 22·edited May 22

I agree,

I'd like to thank you on behalf of ALL females for those very powerful words: "TRUST WOMEN." That comment speaks volumes.

In your biography, you mention your worries for your granddaughter. Although mine are a few years older, I feel the same. I'm both sad and outraged that the wonderful dreams of the future that we as grandparents and their own parents have always wished for them might just turn into nightmares.

During this "graduation season," I wonder about the wide-eyed young people who look forward to a bright future, learning and doing things that we've never seen, heard or read about.

So many times, we've heard the expression "The children are our future." They WILL be our future when Biden wins. I cringe just thinking about the alternative.

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May 22·edited May 22

My granddaughters are 21 and 18. The 21 year old graduated in 3 years from American University and is interning at a Congresswoman’s office before going to graduate school in the fall. The 18 year old is going to Wellesley this fall. Our future looks brighter with young women such as these. Trust Women

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You must be so very proud of them! We could certainly use a few million (did I say that?) more like them. Please tell them to take a little time to play this summer, because they deserve it.

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Dianne, you are so right. And, we do have millions of amazing young women. Now, it's our responsibility to make sure they are not beaten down by fake conservatives who pretend to care about fetuses or anything else related to women. They care about their own power and controlling women through fear. I am hoping our young women refuse to be cowed by would-be rapists, incestors, fake doctors, ignorant white legislators, pseudo-christians, anti-constitutional judges and justices. Power to the women!!

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Amen!

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Thank you. Good advice!

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I agree.

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In Virginia you can get a specialty license plate that says "Trust Women, Protect Choice" (at least for now). I've had one for years.

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Given how WOMEN are now subjected to terrorism to their bodies (yes, I exaggerate, but I feel that way because one of my high school friends died after her boyfriend took her up to New York for a botched back-alley abortion), your plate sends a very important message.

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Too many women ended up like that. Or being instilled with such a sense of shame they never recovered. Too. Many.

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May 23·edited May 23

There's no doubt in my mind that the majority of those who went through such a traumatic experience may never get over that shame, even decades later. My heart goes out for the teenagers and young women who feel tremendous guilt --- and grief ---for hiding their secret from their parents, many of whom passed on without ever knowing.

In the 60's, that's just how it was. Now, the Republicans want to go back to the 60's again, but not the 1960's. Rather the 1860's.

BTW, Amanda, thanks for your service!

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Harrison Butker's commencement speech at Benedictine College was troubling on several levels. https://catholicreview.org/fact-check-house-bill-cracking-down-on-antisemitism-does-not-restrict-biblical-teaching/

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Not least because he was telling young women who had worked and spent a lot of money to earn their degrees were being told that their greatest calling was to be housewives. If they choose that, fine; but it’s pretty tone deaf to go there at a graduation ceremony.

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May 22·edited May 22

It may have been “pretty tone deaf.” But it was also very much the ghost of Traditionalist Catholicism joined at the hip with Evangelical hardliners who seem to think they are God’s workers perpetuating religious dogma - the man made myths - that should have died centuries ago.

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Did he get himself cut yet from the K.C. Chiefs?

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Wondering Woman, that's what happens when ignorant men get to speak at commencement ceremonies when strong women with something valuable to say should be recruited instead. That was a shameful display. I wish the women had stood up and turned their backs on him. As it is, the speaker and those like him will think they have won a victory for their warped religion. They haven't unless we women permit it.

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Why have I not seen a bunch of interviews featuring the voices/thoughts of graduates who were seated in that audience?

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You need to go on TikTok- there were plenty of women outraged by the speech.

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Isn't it a religious school ?

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It is, but beyond the "diabolical lie" remark which had no net positive value for young women graduating who will likely need to work outside the home, my link referred to his comment about legistaltion passed in the House. He and some politicians, like Matt Gaetz, are making stuff up. The phrase "who killed Jesus" is an anti-Semitic trope which the Catholic Church has denounced.

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Is anyone talking about the link between Leonard Leo and the Butker speech? It seems that Leo might have had his hand in this debacle to stir up his super traditionalist flock.

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May 22Liked by Joyce Vance

A Handmaid’s Tale indeed. Thank you Joyce. Some states with abortion bans are now working to label hormone contraceptives and IUDs as abortifacients, e.g. drugs or processes that cause an abortion, reportedly in Missouri and Louisiana among others. I couldn’t find a good reference on how likely this is to succeed.

When I traveled to what was then the Soviet Union in 1979-1980 one of the books absolutely banned from bringing it into the country was 1984. I’d read it by that time and was horrified at how much it matched what I saw there. The same with Animal Farm, which I haven’t seen discussed much in the context of the MAGA crowd, although the pigs equating to some billionaires and the idea that you get ahead by turning others in has an echo in the laws and tip lines in some states about providing information on transgender care and abortion assistance.

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You and I agree on the assessment of 1984 and Animal Farm, Sioux

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The Louisiana law should be held unconstitutional on its face. If the Federal Drug Administration has determined that a drug is safe and effective, that determination should under the Constitution’s Supremacy Clause preempt any state law to the contrary.

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I‘m reading The Demon of Unrest by Erik Larrson. It’s about the time leading up Fort Sumpter. America has a history of this.

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I am just surprised that a bill was presented, is going to be voted on and potentially passed and then to the Governor's desk while the current status of mifepristone is not yet determined by the courts. Until the Supreme Court announces its ruling in 2024, mifepristone is supposed to remain available so I'm just realy confused.

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Their view is apparently that Louisiana can outlaw the drug even if the Supreme Court says it can lawfully be distributed.

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I may be incorrect but I think women vote in higher numbers than men and this is a real human issue concerning women’s lives and families. I hope this results in a massive turnout by women and those who love their mothers, their sisters, wives and daughters.

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I am a poll worker in Florida. It’s scary to see the number of men who try to go in the voting booth with their wives to make sure they “vote right.” Of course, this is not allowed and we ask them to go to their own booth. (However, if looks could kill, I would be dead.). If you pray, pray for us in November.

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I am praying for all poll workers. You are heroes and true patriots.

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Thank you! What a nice thing to say. 2 people (illegally) brought guns to the Republican Presidential Primary. It can get a little scary.

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Marcia, but you stayed and did the work! Kudos to you and the rest of your team!

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Did I imagine scenes of armed "security" outside some polling places, or did that really happen? Too many nightmares to count.

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I am really concerned about that here in Arizona. People are organizing “monitoring parties” for the primaries and general election.

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That’s disgusting. Here is where the DOJ should step in.

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Marcia—if someone would have written about this 10 years ago they would have heard a lot of incredulous comments; me included.

That something like what you’re describing would be happening today makes me ill.

I’m so sorry you’re going through this. It sounds like you’re surrounded by people who are easily led and have surrendered their consciousness. You are obviously very courageous and should be congratulated for your dedication to democracy.

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I was a poll watcher at the 2020 election. The infractions were minor, but I fear there may be.guns in 24.

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I've been an election officer for every election (federal, state, local, primaries) since the 2020 election. No issues here other than a Republican poll watcher who would not shut up while we were trying to work and did his level best to try and impress me with his prowess within the Intelligence Community.

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As Susan pointed out, there are aberrations. Judge Cannon will probably vote for the fascist.

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My mom is 90. My dad loved paper ballots so he could tell her how to vote.

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😩

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I’m reading “The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich”

… talk about prescient! Those who forget the past …

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😱😱😱

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Educate me please Joyce. A state law against obtaining an abortion out of state seems to have a “jurisdiction problem” of the first order.

How do the mechanics of such a law even work?

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This is going to be one of the big legal challenges as soon as a state puts this into effect. I'm guessing Alabama will try to go first. This should not be constitutional, but with this Court, who really knows.

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Well Joyce, if Brett Kavanaugh said it would be unconstitutional in his concurring opinion in Dobbs, what could possibly go wrong, eh ? Afterall, the right does appear in the Articles of Confederation. Probably not an old enough precedent for Alito. Although the Court (remember when we could call it a Supreme, and not an Imperial, Court ?) has actually ruled on the issue before in a 7–2 decision in the 1975 post-Roe Bigelow v. Virginia. The defendant in Bigelow ran a newspaper in Virginia and published an ad for abortions in New York, where they were legal, when they were still illegal in Virginia. The court ruled that Virginia could not prevent its residents from receiving information about services that were lawful where they were to be performed. If Alabama, Texas or any other state attempts to make it a crime for a woman to travel to another state to obtain an abortion that is still lawful there, Justice Harry Blackmun wrote in Bigelow that states cannot apply their laws to conduct undertaken outside their borders. Whether they can punish those who do travel across state lines for abortion care on their return may be another matter.

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There is a long- and well-established right to engage in interstate travel. I can’t see how any state can burden that right to do so for lawful purposes. But five men in black robes could say anything.

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You are correct Mitchell. 2 of the 9 are 'injustices' have serious judicial ethics matters pending.

I wrote to Senator Sheldon Whitehouse supporting his campaign aimed at the Judicial Conference & the Chief Judge seeking specifics actions. aimed at Alito & Thomas.

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And... one woman in black robe.

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Via JUSTIA see, United States vs Guest 383 U.S. 745 (1966) based on the federal constitutional right to travel.

HELD: "If a state [Alabama, Idaho ... ] participated at all in a conspiracy, it has violated the 14th Amendment, with regard to any individuals whose rights are infringed based on the constitutional right to travel" ... among other federal constitutional rights. Id. pp.753-757.

ATTENTION: Women & Families of the State of California. Important, that you have an express California state constitutional Right-of-Privacy under Article 1, Section 7 along with a Bench & Bar capable to protect all constitutional rights, federal & state. Confer with a CA attorney.

'No, no you don't have to live like a refugee'.

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Thank you! I was just writing… Joyce, How does the right to travel apply/relate to this?

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On point among others.

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It really disturbs me that various cities in Texas have passed ordinances prohibiting travel through them for purposes of obtaining an abortion in a neighboring state. Aside from enforcement issues (most likely law enforcement has many problems with the ordinances), the Texas legislature last session passed a law severely restricting cities & counties from passing any ordinances that conflict with state law. These ordinances are plainly unconstitutional but are probably having the desired effect of seeding fear and trepidation.

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The whole point IMO. The miscreants would prefer not to have to enforce and prosecute as you point out --- too costly and messy --- a nice domestic terror campaign would serve even better. However, the 300 lb. political problem in the room is that it affects not only those seeing abortion care, but those who want to carry to term but are afraid of what could happen when problems arise in pregnancy.

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May 22·edited May 22

Totally agree. Good examples are miscarriages & pregnancies (that was me almost bleeding to death internally in 1985). Doctors will be afraid to treat these women for fear they will be criminally prosecuted. Many will die.

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founding

And, to boot, how can that be constitutional, restricting one's ability to travel and "enjoy" the opportunities afforded by another state? My mind twists with a new and ever darker level of lack of comprehension of what's happening in this country...

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You are correct, Marian, it can't. Article 4 (IV) Section 2 paragraph 2. The citizens of each State shall be entitled to all privileges and immunities of citizens in the several States'

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Sarcasm here: it doesn't restrict one gender's ability to travel, so no problem here.

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It is exactly why we are no longer the United States of America! The laws change depending upon what state you are in. Any state that has a GOP legislature is NOT friendly to women. Billboards should be posted at every entry way into a red state that lets travelers know they are entering a state that it is unsafe for women!

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The solution--and I truly believe this--is for the majority of voters in the red states to say, "Enough! We will not accept these extremists positions that place our mothers, sisters, & daughters in peril." It's the people collectively who must insist that this issue be analyzed rationally. A six week embryo is not a baby, nor is a 12 week fetus. Mifepristone should be available to any woman suffering an ectopic pregnancy who is fortunate enough to be diagnosed before that developing embryo tears apart the tissue it implanted in, causing potentially fatal bleeding.

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Missouri threatened blocking interstate abortions right after Dobbs. Our abortions stopped the day of the Dobbs decision. But, drive 15 minutes east into Illinois from St. Louis and there are two clinics. Future senator Eric Schmitt was very displeased with that.

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May 22Liked by Joyce Vance

Maybe 3 books I should reread right now: Rise and Fall of the Third Reich. 1984. Handmaid's Tale. In that order: the one in which I originally read them. There are more that informed me, but yes, these 3 are the ones that symbolized best where we might be headed right now. Taking suggestions for others to add to the list.

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May 22·edited May 22

As a retired psychologist, I have been trying to understand the policies of the authoritarian right. Recently I’ve come across the writing of George Lakoff, the founder of cognitive linguistics. He views conservatives and liberals thinking of government through two different metaphors of the family. For conservatives, this is the strict father family. For liberals, it’s the nurturing parent family. I’ll summarize some of his strict father family metaphor but point you to a podcast he did in 2017 where he lays it out much better.

Here is the order of priorities for the strict father family that seems to effectively model far right policies that make no moral sense to liberals. His paradigmatic metaphors are not always followed absolutely in real life, but when we’re looking at an authoritarian takeover, it sure looks like they adhere closely to the metaphor.

The strict father family protects the authority of the father before all else. The father is the authority over his wife. Both parents are authorities over their children. Those who disobey receive punishments that are sufficiently painful to stop that behavior and teach them self discipline. When they leave the nest, it’s on them to succeed or fail. If they succeed, no one should interfere with their success and they are virtuous. If they fail and fall into poverty, it’s because they’re inferior.

This is the podcast, posted on Soundcloud and found via the FrameLab site. The metaphors are described from 9:30 into the episode to about 18:25. https://www.theframelab.org/1-how-republicans-really-think-122617-6a8/

The nurturant parent family, in contrast, helps those who are in need and does not create an authoritarian hierarchy.

See Lakoff’s Moral Politics (1996, 2nd ed 2016) for more. Also Lakoff and colleagues have a website called FrameLab with lots of useful info for understanding messaging and the workings of propaganda. https://www.theframelab.org/

Lakoff’s isn’t the only salient model. I’ve also found good fits in Bob Altermeyer’s research about the authoritarian personality. He offers his book and articles for free on his website: https://theauthoritarians.org/

I also like Jonathan Haidt et al’s work on Moral Foundations Theory that clearly shows different moral instincts of people across the political spectrum. https://moralfoundations.org/

The bottom line is we’re dealing with populations in our country who have polarizing worldviews that are hard to shake. However, showing that Trump is actually weak and a loser undermines his perceived authority and appealing to values across the political spectrum can be one way to encourage a return to bipartisanship, but only after we have defeated the MAGA movement.

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Thank you, Gary, for your informative contentions and links. Rhetoric has a profound role on society. Kellyanne Conway was a master manipulator.

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Sorry--that should read comments, not contentions. Huge difference!

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It's not just showing that the ex-president is weak. It's looking at everyone in his orbit. People like Steven Miller and Steve Bannon are very active participants.

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Are they really weak ? They have passed and repealed a lot that the rest of us wanted......

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I think it is possible to analyze something to death. I don't need to go digging to get this. I need to do what I can to elect the people who can help us make our society humane and compassionate.

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May 23·edited May 23

I’m actually using the info that way and doing many of the usual things to “elect the people who can help us make our society humane and passionate.” That analysis is useful when I craft messaging and ads to support candidates in a swing district. It also helps me be less judgmental of people who identify with the conservative and far right worldviews.

Also, fellow progressive activists in our organization often exclaim that they don’t understand how people could vote for MAGA. Increasingly I can help them understand, including why it’s so difficult to convert someone who’s drunk the Kool-Aid, so it’s better to reach others you can influence.

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Some good points, Gary- I do the same sort of thing. Years of working with people with widely divergent perspectives and teaching ways to communicate with each other in often contentious situations, including decision-making. My post was about my personal need to grasp the reality of a future that mirrors the dystopia of the books I mentioned. There comes a time when overly intellectual analysis actually gets in the way of processing feelings.

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I’m not asking others to do overly intellectual analysis, of course. We need to get out the vote and do it with simple messages. As someone who has been studying the mind for decades, I’ve wondered about what causes the divide in our country and it’s actually a comfort to me to understand it better than I had previously. Then I know what I’m dealing with. I posted those references for anyone who may be interested, and many have liked my post, which suggests that some people find it useful. Most commenters to this and similar blogs well know the need to take humble actions like postcard writing to GOTV. I do postcarding too.

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It is no longer “might”….it is!!!

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I highly recommend checking them out from your local library as soon as possible, before the MAGA leaders have them banned or destroyed. Then there's always Amazon, which might soon run out of them.

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LOL... so right. Fortunately, I actually still have two of the three, and I think my daughter might have the third. All displayed prominantly at the local bookstore (community-owned!) too, and waiting list at library, along with a few other choice selections.

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You were smart to have kept them.

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Odd, too, considering how many boxes of books I sold or gave away during my moves. Sure wish I'd kept Doris Lessing and more of my books of poetry, as well. (I have built a whole new set of books to decorate my floor and table tops since, though.)

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I have been curious for some time how Hipaa regulations come into play when states demand to know intimate information about women's health care. Hipaa is a federal law, and I thought it should supercede a state's desire to seek and attack women and physicians through wrongfully gained diagnosis information.

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May 22·edited May 22

I've wondered about the HIPPA laws, too. Makes me wonder what really happens after you've initialed the spaces where you say it's okay or not okay to share with your other doctor(s). I've seen that on some forms and have recently become very been concerned, given all the database hacking that's compromising huge medical groups, insurance companies, and the like. I had to change my Medicare number and my secondary insurance numbers, and that's not an easy task.

Big Brother would be very happy to know who's pregnant, how far along she is, where she lives, what state she plans to visit in the next eight or nine months, or things like that. Law enforcement agencies encourage people with the phrase, "If you see something, SAY something." As a former Neighborhood Watch president in a community of 2,000 homes, I firmly agree with that. Unfortunately, MAGAts would go to any length to turn that phrase around to please Big Brother.

Off the topic a tiny bit, but what really makes me sick is while it's okay for men to tell women what they can or can't do with their bodies, the only thing we see on TV regarding men's sexual lives are many, many commercials for those suffering the trauma of ED.

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Or the bent dick one. How heartbreaking.

Gods will, I say. About that and nothing else.

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You are correct Mary Anne, HIPPA is Federal and absolutely outranks any State or local law. HIPPA wasn't enacted until 1996 but every County, State, and Federal Agency had to have each and every employee or person doing business with any organization had to swear to uphold AND obey every word to the letter of the word.

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May 22·edited May 22

Like you, I re-read 1984 and The. Handmaid’s Tale during the early Trump years. Every day as I watch Deadline: WhiteHouse on MSNBC my husband walks by and asks “is Trump in jail yet.” One day. One day, I will say “yes.”

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I really LIKE your husband! Wish I could be there when you get to tell him "Yes."

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Also check out Sinclair Lewis's It Can't Happen Here, written in the 1930s. Lewis's book was meant to warn readers of the impending threat of Hitler - but it's a frightening portrayal of the Trump 2025 plan as Lewis's demagogue Buzz Windrip and the Minute Men, his army of thugs, take over the government, silence the press, and consign opponents to concentrations camps.

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The only word that comes to mind is" despicable "! What kind of a world are we living in. Women's rights stripped away, drugs withheld.

I wonder if interracial marriages could be next. Oh! But Justice Thomas would never let that be passed.

Everytime a new, indecent law is passed , there is always a cadre of men approving it.

If we, women and men , don't put a stop to this lunacy in November, we will be writing the future for our children and beyond.

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Last I heard Justice Thomas was all for outlawing interracial marriages. Not quite sure how that would work for him, other than himself being above the law…

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