Today, Donald Trump issued what can only be construed as a shot across the bow, after the Magistrate Judge Moxila Upadhyaya admonished him during arraignment yesterday that he must not commit any new crimes while on a pre-trial bond—the thing that’s keeping him out of jail before trial—and that efforts to influence or intimidate witnesses, jurors or others involved in the case were illegal.
This psychopath needs to be warned by the judge and have his bond rescinded. He is a danger to all. I can just imagine what would be happening if he were a person of color or a women.
… a danger to our society…. Including those so gullible in his base who unwittingly believe everything he says and follow up exercising the behaviors he elicits in his verbiage. Look how many indicted for attacking the on January 6th have said they came to DC because he told them to
And that poor sap, Ricky Shiffer, who should be on TFG's conscience, if he had one.
"After the search at Mar-a-Lago and Trump’s posts condemning law enforcement, an Ohio man, Ricky Shiffer, was killed while attacking an FBI office in response."
Isn't he using some kind of social media platform that he owns? I think he was booted from Twitter, then launched a platform for his followers. And that's where he is now posting. So folks are recommending the only remedy: put him where he cannot post to them.
At some point there will be, but I trust the readiness of The National Guard and our executive branch, i.e. calling for quelling any aggression. Just like calling the Guard to confront the mobs when southern schools first admitted a black child.
Well, we can count on the National Guard so long as Biden is our President. If the nightmare should, by any horrid chance, come true, and the orange sadist got into office again (NO!!! NO!!! NO!!!!!), he's already planned to appointment that sick puppy, Jeffrey Clark, to be his AG. And it is Clark who wanted to call out the federal troops to make the orange sadist the "official" prezident.
Meaningless warnings if the judge doesn’t take action. And so far no judge has stopped Trump from trying to run the trial in public (at rallies and Truth Social) as we all know he will refuse to testify in court. Why do they let him get away with this. The longer this goes on the worse he will get and there will definitely be blood on the streets from his MAGA supporters. I’m very depressed how everyone seems so afraid of him and MAGA and allow this.
He has marshaled his White Men’s forces. But let us not think they won’t do untold damage to this nation. Trump is the most vile creature ever to walk the halls of the White House. And frankly, it would be wise to end the Trump era by whatever means necessary.
I completely agree with “by any means necessary.” This has gone on long enough. The imprisonment or death, not murder, of trump will not end this. He has infected the country. I believe he his egging on Jack Smith and the Judge to take action that he can appeal causing a delay in his trial. If it was me I would ban him from ALL social media. Of course his lawyers would claim I’m violating his First Amendment rights. Whatever happened to the concept that you can’t yell fire in a crowded movie theater?
Bill, you are correct. It's as though we will have to do that kind of therapy that brings folks back from belonging to a cult. I'm seeing some 'small' evidence of folks waking up to Trump (post indictments). A neighbor has removed her 'Trump 2024' flag that she had been so proudly flying. I had to pass her house to walk the puppers to the river - it was like passing a car accident: I couldn't look away no matter how much I disliked it. And she has begun associating (again) with the blue neighbors. Small hope - but I do have it:) Blessings to you.
Seeing the same here. Friend of 35 years and I tiptoe around political talk for the sake of the friendship. At coffee, we were discussing the lack of progress on gun control in light of the latest school shooting. Her great -grands are starting public school this fall. She said "I don't think I can vote for Trump again." A college educated professional, it didn't become real until it became personal.
That is good news. I too think that now that actual legal consequences are happening & the depth of his crimes are revealed, a small portion of the MAGA faithful will come to their senses & distance from Trump.
Do you think the Kennedy brothers were assassinated within the rule of law? I’d lay the blame for those atrocities on the CIA and the Mafia hit men, but that’s an old story still writing itself a thousand times over. The Warren Commission? Never.
Yes - after the stern specific public warning that he violated, he moved into the UNPROTECTED speech terrain, and just before his lawyers are required to receive so much more specific and required-to-stay-confidential information that his proven pattern of behavior puts at serious risk. The kind of risk that puts community and personal safety at risk (based on past publicly reported behavior). I even wonder why he’s not considered a flight risk. He has the resources, the connections, and the motive - and talk about a risk to national security!
Now that’s funny as hell. I imagine him rushing to his Trump plane and the pilot asks, “Where to, sir?” And Trump answers, “I don’t fricken know. Just get the plane up. Maybe we can keep the plane flying forever.”
I’m not sure but I don’t think freaken is in any well respected dictionary. I could be wrong which is why the kids all groaned when I was put on their spelling bee team as a last choice. Or was it Spelling Be?
I agree 100%. I understand taking into consideration what he or his lawyers might do -- but we cannot ignore what he is ACTUALLY doing. He is a direct threat to our democracy. He is a direct threat to witnesses and anyone else involved in his trials. He will not constrain himself, he must be restrained by the judge and law enforcement, ie prison.
Max, I believe they want “blood in the streets” If police are overrun by magas and or order breaks down, what recourse does the government have other than the military? Then they have an excuse to cry “dictatorship” and blame it on Dems. Just a bigger and more dangerous pattern that the Repugnants already use.
Let the MAGAs say or claim anything they want. If they storm over police again in another attempt to take over the country, Biden has no choice but protect our country with our military - exactly what the Insurrection Act was intended for. My worry is how many Trump MAGAs were planted by Trump in the military. I don’t think Biden has done any investigations to find these people and expel them. And that’s a concern - Insurrection soldiers from within.
All the more reason he shouldn’t be able to testify on the case with lies and threats in public at his rallies and on Truth with no challenges as occurs in court. We all know he wouldn’t testify in court - so trying to one-side testify (without challenge) should not be allowed. He should have freedom of speech to run as a candidate and present his intended policies. But the threats, lies and attacks about others involved in the trial are NOT fair game (judges, prosecutors, witnesses, jurists, etc). He’s AGAIN inciting his mob. Bottom line he should not be able to speak in public in any way about the trial.
" Trump is on notice that his words provoke people to violence...." I imagine that Trump takes it as a compliment - not a warning - that he can provoke people to violence. He loves knowing he has so many obedient followers and that he can tie the DOJ and judges in knots while Jack Smith focuses on getting a trial started. This is how he's lived his miserable, worthless life. Pathetic - and dangerous.
I don' think this is an attempt to intimidate Smith or other officials, I think it is an attempt, nay a threat to those who might have flipped or are thinking about flipping. I think he is capable of anything; remember he said he could shoot someone on 5th Avenue...I truly believe he is capable of hiring hit men. Has anyone, but me wondered why the two employees charged with Trump in Florida are not flipping on him. Are their families safe? I don't know, but I do feel in my bones he is capable of the worst imaginable.
I think it is also an attempt to intimidate and threaten future jurors. As a private citizen, would you want to sit on a jury after he has used his megaphone to say that “he” will come after you? And speaking of megaphones, he can post this on “Truth” Social, which doesn’t have a very large audience, knowing that major “news” outlets will pick it up to further amplify it.
agree, he knows that he will be amplified because his horrible words mean more viewers and more revenue. The orange evil -one gets too much press. Preying on greed is another mob tactic.
I thought of that. Isn't that what crime bosses do? Keeping his men in line? His X attorney warned us that Donald is a dangerous man. If Jack Smith gives over any information it will be Christmas to Donald. He has shown that he does not follow the rules.
Or has anyone wondered about Ivana's death and subsequent interment at Trump's National Golf Club in Bedminster NJ...? So many questions (and quite a few substantial responses) to the nature of her demise and the reason for choosing Bedminster as her final resting place. See especially the WaPo's Aug. 1, 2022 article about the latter. https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/08/01/ivana-trump-buried-tax-break-grift/
Dartmouth professor Brooke Harrington, a specialist in tax optimization, checked the New Jersey tax code and reported that operating a cemetery at the Trump National offers “a trifecta of tax avoidance. Property, income & sales tax, all eliminated.” She tweeted that it “looks like one corpse will suffice to make at least 3 forms of tax vanish.”
You’re not alone in your thinking. I have imagined that he’s got something on his allied buffoons. Maybe something tied to Jeffery Epstein? Or maybe he threatens these people with the lives of their families. He’s a mean man.
Which makes that mob boss more dangerous than ever. A cornered psychopath is very dangerous because they don't care who they hurt in their attempts to protect themselves. They don't care about people and they don't care about nations.
“They don't care about people…” I’ll take that one step further:
Some psychopaths not only don’t care about other people, there’s a subset that actively takes joy in watching their victims suffer. Unhappily American history is rife with examples.
I don't think Trump necessarily has that in him (he's weak, just an overfed power-monger who can't see beyond his belly or beyond the reach of his stubby little fingers), but it's not the same about the most violent of his followers —who he dispatches on his whims, and then directs.
That was on full display on January 6: who gets off on blinding one cop by poking him in the eye by with a flagpole, or another, by pulling away the officer’s respirator so as to gas the man with bear spray? Those inflicted cruelties weren't necessary, and they had to be recreational in nature.
Bringing us back to the Mob Boss thing: Trump NEVER has to get blood on his hands, and he never does: he counts on his sadistically-inclined sycophants to take care of those kinds of things.
All he ever needs to do is say something like “There are good people on both sides (nudge nudge wink wink, you swastika-flag wavers)”, or “Stand down and stand by!” —which the Oath Keepers took as an emphasis on stand by (and not the “stand down” part). And all he ever needs to hear in return is “I took care of that thing for ya, boss”.
“How's Paulie?”
“ah, Paulie. You won’t see him no more.”
That’s the dangerous part: The invisible hand, impelled by a killer/slave-master mentality.
Agree. He is a mob boss in the sense that he doesn't get his hands dirty, he doesn't do the hard work, he gets others to do it for him. That he is masterful in gathering people who have strong sociopathic and sadistic tendencies (I think he enjoys watching - as we saw on Jan 6) and feels more powerful as he gets these people to put themselves in legal jeopardy for him, that he seems to have a power to bring out the worst in people, and that when people are in groups they are more likely to act in ways they may not individually, AND that he has had the power of the Presidency -- that is a recipe for disaster of major proportions.
Charlie Manson was a psychopath -- but he never murdered anyone himself. He got others to do it for him.
Well put. I overlooked Manson but that’s basically it, isn’t it. Good example.
I had thought to reference (but didn’t want to seem too wordy) that conversation In “The Godfather Part II”, in Hyman Roth's “We’re bigger than US Steel!” speech, where he is explaining to Michael how well-positioned the organization (read: the Mob) was, for future success:
“Just one small step: looking for a man who wants to be President of the United States, and having the cash to make it possible.”
I submit that in 2015 they found that man.
That Trump’s teacher, mentor, and early fixer was Mob lawyer Roy Cohn, speaks volumes to that possibility.
It’s my view that Trump was/is too much of a dull knife to realize that Roy Cohn was gay, if that’s what you might have been wondering about there.*
Apparently Trump dropped him like a hot potato when Cohn de facto got outed when he came down with AIDS, after which Trump never spoke to him again —and I myself don't believe for one second that that cut-off was due to any possible apprehension of Trump about catching the disease from Cohn: Trump doesn't fear viruses, remember? (Besides, even if Trump was afraid of that, he could always have just picked up the phone to wish his friend well.)
*(Although I wouldn't dismiss the possibility of Cohn having some kind of a one-way-street “lust” for Trump —perhaps just a lust for the power he thought Trump held: in retrospect there always did seem to to be a certain “Smithers” / “Mr. Burns” air about their relationship.)
All very plausible. I wrote my book because he was the most bizarre president ever and I’ll never do it again. Now I’ll return to my cat manuscript that I put aside. Aug 5 wow. You did some research
ha. Not really, about either the long dwell-time since August 5th (I only came back here to read this topic again because one other of our fellow scribes commented positively about something else I wrote here, and I wanted to revisit the conversation) or about “did some research”: nope, not really. I try to pay attention, is all, in answer to your (as it were) query.
I've always been an avid listener to NPR —and since retirement, Pacifica stations, and then because I bought a car with a GREAT podcast-collecting function (a car that needs supercharging a lot, which facilitates me uninterrupted listening periods of just drinking in Joyce here, Preet Bharara, and the joys of Heather Cox Richardson in delightfully insightful conversations with Joanne Freeman, those kinds of things… my, we do live in good times.
I’m not writing all of this because I am a self-referential blowhard or do not self-edit well (both offenses which may successfully be levied against me), but because this is the new way of the world.
Some people on my old crew would ask from time to time, “What news do YOU listen to?”, as if there's got to be some new single-point Walter Cronkite or LIFE magazine replacements out there… but of course we know there are not.
And it comes down to things like this, it is THE question of our times, unhappily these times of Rupert Murdoch, Tucker, and pertinently, our previous President, and the answer is: we all have to be our own News Editors these days. Which is kind of an unsatisfactory response to folks who are looking for the new Cronkite, but oh well.
As a matter of fact I learned that Trump/Cohn business from listening to an interview with a writer working for the NY Post, whose beat for -decades- was covering Trump for that tabloid, when T was a merely a rich but dismissible NYC celebrity… I chose to believe this writer because his telling of the story, had veracity, and lined up with all other extant facts about the Orange Man… and that’s how it’s done these days.
hurrah for “Civil Discourse”. And the chickens! There IS hope for our democracy!
I understand. Blogging is relatively new for me. I often write in my weekly for free. I recently figured how to activate the notice me button when someone responds to a comment. I rather communicate in my song lyrics. But that’s a whole other difficult place to break through. Just in case, my YouTube channel is: Catman Bill — Hartford, Connecticut.
Getting my news consists of BBC at 6 TV. Then network news at 6:30 and The News Hour at 7. That mostly ends my TV exposure. I subscribe to the New York Times. I used to subscribe to Washington Post but the permanently banned me for explaining how I would crap on the steps of the US capital one day as Trump was being waked inside. Life goes on. I was a Mother Jones reader paid subscriber too and they once sent me into permanent moderation and after I begged them to lift it but wouldn’t, I asked for my remaining money back. I guess I have a way with words since I wrote what I think is the most scathing anti Trump book in the marketplace. And just came out with a second edition. I am very happy with Joyce Vance and Heather Cox Richardson. They are invaluable to my se se of knowledge. Just last week, I attended an all day Stop Trump symposium at Cooper Union in New York. It was reciting. Everyone was there on stage; George Conway, Mary Trump, Miles Taylor, Michael Cohen the fixer. He was a bit arrogant with me later when I approached him but it’s just New York can deal. Robert DeNero was to speak but he had Covid. And a bunch more.
At some point, his blustering threats must be met with consequences. Regardless of what anyone on his side believes, he has been warned, and thus far he has NEVER been held responsible for any of his actions, outside of the E. Jean Cameron case. Time to make him pay like any other 2-bit crook. Thanks, Joyce. Carry on.
I’m old enough to remember the word “punk” in reference to unintelligent street hoods. This is what he is, just a punk. We have to remember that he is a child of Brooklyn, NY. My sincere apologies to the wonderful people of Brooklyn.
It also referred to a kept sexual partner in prison who belonged to a powerful daddy.. “Punks” were said to be entitled and arrogant out of fear of their “daddy.” Snotty and intolerable and prone to “accidents.”
I think the fact that he is walking around and not incarcerated is a reflection of our two- tiered system of justice, one for entitled, wealthy people and one for folks with no legal or financial support. Additionally, because of his political position and past presidency, I suspect Smith and the judge fear taking any further action, inflaming his base and bringing further charges of "witch hunt" from delusional or dishonest Republucans. And so for now he can go on being Donald and disregarding normal rules and protocols. I have to remind myself that this is a marathon not a sprint, but oh my gosh I can't WAIT for the trial that will finally bring an end to his criminality and give us the justice we all deserve.
I write postcards through Activate America and letters through Vote Forward. I find both organizations are well organized and very effective. I am disabled and limited in physical activity - so being able to contribute in ways that I can is very satisfying.
As Joyce pointed out, it's more likely to make the hard core Trumpists act out and result in chaos. They have their own reality. If they haven't been jolted out of it by now (many have, I might point out), they never will.
Trump is desperate, and putting him in a cell, as Joyce pointed out, would likely result in delaying the trial- the last thing we want. Better is to keep leaning on him, hard. If he appears to be threatening any actual person, that's another potential charge. The more there are, the more likely he'll back himself so far into the corner he's already in.
I am puzzled though. We're letting a terrorist go free because we're afraid of the result and afraid of his followers. Afraid is the key word here that bugs me. If he's found guilty, he may serve time anyway, so we're just delaying the chaos.
The trial being delayed may not be a problem if he's found guilty. The result of his trial(s) may not happen until after the election. If he is confined without a cell phone, if that's possible, he is limited to telling his visitors what to do for him, and limited to winning or losing the nomination and/or the presidency from confinement. A new twist in the American story.
Sometimes I feel like wake me up when it's over, then I'll deal with it. Trump's megalomania and demagoguery dominates everything important that we need to take care of in this country. If he wins, we'll have more of it for years to come, not to mention the damage Republicans will do.
The tiny percent of wealthy donors and corporations that support Republicans are not afraid of climate change and have no intention of helping ordinary Americans, other than making sure they are able to work when they need a warm body in addition to AI and robots. They may drive out "elite intellectuals" and eliminate objective news programs. The immigration system is too broken for talented immigrants to be admitted to the country. SS and Medicare and Obamacare will be further slashed, making our healthcare system worse than it is now.
I know, it's a dire prediction, but it could actually go darker than that, with a police state and KGB style surveillance with drones and more sophisticated technologies. They might really weaponize the Dept of Justice, going after activists and writers. It happens in other countries.
This is basically a summary of what we have been talking about for months. And it is why it is important that we bring Trumpt to trial according to the processes that have been laid out in law. It is also important, as we keep saying, that we all do what we can to make 2024 a blue election in as many places and at as many levels as we can, doing what we can as we can. To keep that dark future from happening. To prove Democracy works. We the people can win, but not by wringing our hands and visualizing every possible dark outcome and then failing to do everything we can to prevent it. As Joyce reminds us, we are in this together.
Fox "news" is actively lying and brainwashing for votes and possible jurors. That's why you hear so much "free speech" and "election fraud" still to this day, despite the indictment and the endless recounts. Trump's supporters believe the lies and use the same talking points to their peers. That's what's different today than years ago without Fox "news", when someone would lose an election for being unfaithful to their wife.
I think your prediction has a great likelihood of coming true if Trump wins in 2024 and the GOP keeps the House and takes the Senate. We will cease to be a democracy and go the way of Hungary and Poland and become an authoritarian state. Liberals have been warning for years about climate change and have been ridiculed as hyperbolic. We're literally in it now. And there's no going back. We have to keep up the fight, take the threat seriously. The vote is our strongest voice. For now.
For what, please? Sometimes the answer to prayer is "this one's on you, kid". It's up to us to do what needs to be done, not just wait for "somebody" to fix things. As Betsy said in her post, "Vote, make calls, write postcards, text, but most importantly, VOTE." It's not just Trump we need to worry about. It's how the election turns out. The time to start that work is now. All up and down the ballot.
Because he won't abide by it. It took less than 36 hours for him to outright defy the judge's orders. The only way to keep him silent is to make sure he doesn't have a phone, a tablet, a computer, or any way to speak out and/or publish his vile speech. The only way to do that is from a jail cell where the environment is completely contained.
Oh for heaven's sake. Enough is enough. This guy is dangerous. Lock him up and take that damn phone away. Toddlers are more mature than this blister on society.
Trump is more like a supperating boil on the nation's behind. A blister implies that there might have been actual work involved--and we all know Trump is allergic to actual work.
Trump is just mad because of the unflattering arraignment day photos--one showing bad hair and liddle hands and o l d all in the same shot. That’s exactly the kind of thing that would make a guy like him sound off with a nasty threat.
No, he’s mad because his attorney introduced him as “President Trump” in his arraignment and the judge addressed him as “Mr. Trump”. He’s just a plain ole guy like us chickens and it makes him sick. Good!
Menacing- that is the primary stance that malignant narcissistic authoritarians like trump always project out at and into their victims, as they relentlessly dominate others through inflicting inescapable fear. It’s the instilling of constant terror in every family member to obtain total submission to the abuser that I’ve seen, that mirrors trump’s menacing presence writ large. The message is- “If you ever challenge my power and authority over you in any way, you will pay severely- there is no escaping the harm I can and will inflict on you.” Of course this is the classic way that ruthless rulers and dictators have operated throughout history. As trump enters his nightmare of having to sit silently in court day after day for weeks on end, as scores of witnesses reveal the details of his crimes, it’s quite possible he will become so filled with inchoate rage, that he will become emotionally incapacitated and be unable to function. I’m not wishing that on him at all, but for inflated, grandiose and predatory narcissists like him, the ordeal ahead where he will feel so helpless and powerless, is really going to be a horror. For me, I hope justice is fairly served. I will always mourn the hundreds of thousands of Americans that needlessly died because of his criminal and heartless negligence during the pandemic when he was president.
I love this cogent detailed response. I think he knows that folks are lining up to testify against him - and thus, to save their own skins. He has already been sending threatening messages (perhaps through his minions). He recently asked whether employee 4 (Taveras?) was loyal. When his assistant Walt made inquiries and went back to Trump with 'Yes, he is loyal,' Trump told him he would hire an attorney for him. Everything is contingent on his having unquestioned loyalty. I am wondering - and it's ok if you have no answer - but if Walt has been witness to Trump's threats and making others 'pay severely' perhaps he is frightened? Also, is there a way to know if he is truly 'emotionally incapacitated and unable to function'? Is one able to fake that kind of behavior? And who would determine if that were the case? I know the court may order a psychiatric examination, but how would they choose the psychiatrist? Is there a list of the 'best' in the field, such as they have for heart surgeons and such? Do they just 'know' these things and have a list of who to call? I have thought for a couple of weeks that he might fake a scenario of some kind that would have Ivanka or someone admit him to a psychiatric hospital to avoid the court trial. But you are suggesting it is an actual possibility for a 'narcissist authoritarian' like Trump. I mourn as well the hundreds of thousands of Americans that needlessly died because of his negligence. When he became ill with Covid, he had the best of emergency care and after-care (he had a litany of expensive herbal supplements and IV treatments to which the average person did not have access). Still: his behavior was "I'm on board, pull up the ladder." He had the best care but did not promote mask wearing, distancing, or vaccines. I also mourn as well the ruined careers of distinguished government workers, career military officers, and career diplomats all of whom he demeaned and caused to resign (or he fired them and proceeded to 'smear' them). I mourn the business executives who resigned from their firms and put businesses on hold to accept cabinet positions (in good faith), but to learn first-hand what a dictator he was and that he would not make decisions as a team player. While the invaders of the Capitol were thugs, and most may never have opened a civics book (or, it didn't 'take'), they did as they did because they trusted Trump. Many are broken and in jail. We can ask: 'What were they thinking?' I really don't know - but there may have been a profile that Trump discovered among them and then he was able to 'rope them in.' A kind of cult personality. They seemed to have (and some still do) as a multi-level sales business: 'Do this because so and so is doing it." It is just a grifting Ponzi scheme. So finally, if/when he becomes emotionally incapacitated, it solves the problem of whether he can run the country if he is elected after being convicted. He would be found mentally incompetent, whether elected or not.
Valere I’m grateful for your caring and mourning for the countless people harmed by trump. I wouldn’t be surprised that by the second or third week in court he began to become psychologically and emotionally overwhelmed. I can’t say what would happen then. For his sake i hope that doesn’t happen- and for the sake of justice being fully carried out too.
His niece is a psychologist, and has written a couple of books that go into this. She has made much the same call you have, but in detail and from the inside. She is a brave and thoughtful person, herself damaged as the result of the Trump family dynamics. Many of us have a better sense of his malignant narcissism as a result of her willingness to write a difficult story.
Valerie What a beautiful & thorough description of the extent of the damage he has done & the lives he has hurt or even destroyed. The extent is breathtaking.
Agreed. Severe personality disorders are brittle & incapable of adaptation. His personality structure is fragmenting the more he is cornered & is likely to tip further into dysfunction eg psychoticism, in my opinion. His cronies who enable him make him more dangerous.
There was a disturbance in Union Square NYC this afternoon. It involved numerous police cars rushing through our nearby neighborhood to establish order. One of my neighbors and I discussed it later in the evening. We both thought his supporters were either protesting or attacking. Reality is the incident had nothing to do with him, but suspect these thoughts and reactions will occur frequently during the rest of the Summer and beyond.
Thank you Joyce for informing how each step, and response, should happen as a reaction to his abhorrent message on a social network.
Good on Jack Smith for flagging this so quickly to the judge.
This psychopath needs to be warned by the judge and have his bond rescinded. He is a danger to all. I can just imagine what would be happening if he were a person of color or a women.
Any ordinary citizen for that matter.
Yes!
He's been warned ⚠️, time ⏲️ for pretrial detention.
Great!
I really hope they put him in jail soon, he is a danger to our society
… a danger to our society…. Including those so gullible in his base who unwittingly believe everything he says and follow up exercising the behaviors he elicits in his verbiage. Look how many indicted for attacking the on January 6th have said they came to DC because he told them to
And that poor sap, Ricky Shiffer, who should be on TFG's conscience, if he had one.
"After the search at Mar-a-Lago and Trump’s posts condemning law enforcement, an Ohio man, Ricky Shiffer, was killed while attacking an FBI office in response."
At the very least take him off social media!
Isn't he using some kind of social media platform that he owns? I think he was booted from Twitter, then launched a platform for his followers. And that's where he is now posting. So folks are recommending the only remedy: put him where he cannot post to them.
Good point... I hadn't thought about that. I was thinking the judge would order him to stay off any social media.
Apparently, for a lot of money he can follow some rules:
https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-63725948
Wow! Thank you for this:)
Elon Musk was (is?) planning to return his platform on twitter -- or, rather, X.
He already did.
I'm with you, although I have an imagination vivid enough to envision the chaos that would ensue if that should occur.
Not holding him accountable would be worse for our country.
No doubt there will chaos, but no one is above the law. He will put himself in jail by his words.
We are waiting!
Yup. Dangerous fellow Americans…The same folks who cling to numerous fire arms almost universally adore Trump.
I haven't seen a count on that, but it's an easy assumption to make.
At some point there will be, but I trust the readiness of The National Guard and our executive branch, i.e. calling for quelling any aggression. Just like calling the Guard to confront the mobs when southern schools first admitted a black child.
He's hoping for a delay, according to everybody. Putting him in custody would delay his trial. We say no.
It would also muffle his campaign...which would bring more lawsuits. THIS IS HIS GAME
Well, we can count on the National Guard so long as Biden is our President. If the nightmare should, by any horrid chance, come true, and the orange sadist got into office again (NO!!! NO!!! NO!!!!!), he's already planned to appointment that sick puppy, Jeffrey Clark, to be his AG. And it is Clark who wanted to call out the federal troops to make the orange sadist the "official" prezident.
Meaningless warnings if the judge doesn’t take action. And so far no judge has stopped Trump from trying to run the trial in public (at rallies and Truth Social) as we all know he will refuse to testify in court. Why do they let him get away with this. The longer this goes on the worse he will get and there will definitely be blood on the streets from his MAGA supporters. I’m very depressed how everyone seems so afraid of him and MAGA and allow this.
He has marshaled his White Men’s forces. But let us not think they won’t do untold damage to this nation. Trump is the most vile creature ever to walk the halls of the White House. And frankly, it would be wise to end the Trump era by whatever means necessary.
I completely agree with “by any means necessary.” This has gone on long enough. The imprisonment or death, not murder, of trump will not end this. He has infected the country. I believe he his egging on Jack Smith and the Judge to take action that he can appeal causing a delay in his trial. If it was me I would ban him from ALL social media. Of course his lawyers would claim I’m violating his First Amendment rights. Whatever happened to the concept that you can’t yell fire in a crowded movie theater?
I too believe he is purposefully attempting to cause delay
Yes it’s what he does. But re his emotional & mental instability - he is not faking that.
Wow! What a perfect metaphor: "he has INFECTED the country".
I think we need to be careful here. “by whatever means necessary” -within the rule of law.
I was evoking the Malcolm X statement. And I did say era as opposed to an individual. Take it for what it’s worth.
Bill, you are correct. It's as though we will have to do that kind of therapy that brings folks back from belonging to a cult. I'm seeing some 'small' evidence of folks waking up to Trump (post indictments). A neighbor has removed her 'Trump 2024' flag that she had been so proudly flying. I had to pass her house to walk the puppers to the river - it was like passing a car accident: I couldn't look away no matter how much I disliked it. And she has begun associating (again) with the blue neighbors. Small hope - but I do have it:) Blessings to you.
Valere
Seeing the same here. Friend of 35 years and I tiptoe around political talk for the sake of the friendship. At coffee, we were discussing the lack of progress on gun control in light of the latest school shooting. Her great -grands are starting public school this fall. She said "I don't think I can vote for Trump again." A college educated professional, it didn't become real until it became personal.
That is good news. I too think that now that actual legal consequences are happening & the depth of his crimes are revealed, a small portion of the MAGA faithful will come to their senses & distance from Trump.
Do you think the Kennedy brothers were assassinated within the rule of law? I’d lay the blame for those atrocities on the CIA and the Mafia hit men, but that’s an old story still writing itself a thousand times over. The Warren Commission? Never.
He is a creature right out of central casting. He has crossed that Rubicon now is the time to incarnate him.
Surely you intend “incarcerate” him WITHOUT ACCESS TO DEVICES TO POST TO INTERNET IE TRUTH SOCIAL & ALL OTHER PLATFORMS.
Yes - after the stern specific public warning that he violated, he moved into the UNPROTECTED speech terrain, and just before his lawyers are required to receive so much more specific and required-to-stay-confidential information that his proven pattern of behavior puts at serious risk. The kind of risk that puts community and personal safety at risk (based on past publicly reported behavior). I even wonder why he’s not considered a flight risk. He has the resources, the connections, and the motive - and talk about a risk to national security!
Forgive me for saying it:
LOCK HIM UP!
Now that’s funny as hell. I imagine him rushing to his Trump plane and the pilot asks, “Where to, sir?” And Trump answers, “I don’t fricken know. Just get the plane up. Maybe we can keep the plane flying forever.”
Idea; fly to the Caribbean and run out of fuel over the Bermuda Triangle or simply disappear as many inexplicably do!
If only....
Oops. It’s wise to review and edit.
Must giggle about something. You’re a good guy!
For today. Sentiments will change without any doubt.
FYI....”freaking”.......gotcha 😂🤣
I’m not sure but I don’t think freaken is in any well respected dictionary. I could be wrong which is why the kids all groaned when I was put on their spelling bee team as a last choice. Or was it Spelling Be?
that last sounds threatening and/or wishing for harm to come to him. I disagree with that utterly. The law is to be relied upon.
His largest voting block is white women
Election 2020
Trump. 42%women, 53% men
Biden. 57% women, 45% men
I thought white men.
I agree 100%. I understand taking into consideration what he or his lawyers might do -- but we cannot ignore what he is ACTUALLY doing. He is a direct threat to our democracy. He is a direct threat to witnesses and anyone else involved in his trials. He will not constrain himself, he must be restrained by the judge and law enforcement, ie prison.
I agree with you totally and don’t understand why he is not in jail
Max, I believe they want “blood in the streets” If police are overrun by magas and or order breaks down, what recourse does the government have other than the military? Then they have an excuse to cry “dictatorship” and blame it on Dems. Just a bigger and more dangerous pattern that the Repugnants already use.
Let the MAGAs say or claim anything they want. If they storm over police again in another attempt to take over the country, Biden has no choice but protect our country with our military - exactly what the Insurrection Act was intended for. My worry is how many Trump MAGAs were planted by Trump in the military. I don’t think Biden has done any investigations to find these people and expel them. And that’s a concern - Insurrection soldiers from within.
Oh, yes. That has certainly a worry of mine too.
Fear not. The Lord is in this. Prayer is the key.
Not really! This is a legal move!
To be fair, as a defendant he has no obligation or incentive to testify at trial.
All the more reason he shouldn’t be able to testify on the case with lies and threats in public at his rallies and on Truth with no challenges as occurs in court. We all know he wouldn’t testify in court - so trying to one-side testify (without challenge) should not be allowed. He should have freedom of speech to run as a candidate and present his intended policies. But the threats, lies and attacks about others involved in the trial are NOT fair game (judges, prosecutors, witnesses, jurists, etc). He’s AGAIN inciting his mob. Bottom line he should not be able to speak in public in any way about the trial.
I agree. He needs guardrails like a baby in a crib... He can't help himself. And he needs to be held accountable if he goes over the guardrails.
Amen to that Max E.
Well said Max E
" Trump is on notice that his words provoke people to violence...." I imagine that Trump takes it as a compliment - not a warning - that he can provoke people to violence. He loves knowing he has so many obedient followers and that he can tie the DOJ and judges in knots while Jack Smith focuses on getting a trial started. This is how he's lived his miserable, worthless life. Pathetic - and dangerous.
I don' think this is an attempt to intimidate Smith or other officials, I think it is an attempt, nay a threat to those who might have flipped or are thinking about flipping. I think he is capable of anything; remember he said he could shoot someone on 5th Avenue...I truly believe he is capable of hiring hit men. Has anyone, but me wondered why the two employees charged with Trump in Florida are not flipping on him. Are their families safe? I don't know, but I do feel in my bones he is capable of the worst imaginable.
He doesn’t need to hire hit men. “Will no one rid me of this turbulent priest?” At least some followers receive the message.
Scary.
Good point.
Whew! Haven't heard that hypothesis before re Nauta and de Olivera, but it makes sense. HORRIBLE sense...
I think it is also an attempt to intimidate and threaten future jurors. As a private citizen, would you want to sit on a jury after he has used his megaphone to say that “he” will come after you? And speaking of megaphones, he can post this on “Truth” Social, which doesn’t have a very large audience, knowing that major “news” outlets will pick it up to further amplify it.
I'll be a juror.
I'll join you.
Me too
Me, three
I would gladly serve as a juror …and bet my life on doing so.
Me, too. That makes 4 of us, so far.
agree, he knows that he will be amplified because his horrible words mean more viewers and more revenue. The orange evil -one gets too much press. Preying on greed is another mob tactic.
Although I think this statement is important because Jack Smith is reporting it to the judge, though not requesting any action (yet).
I thought of that. Isn't that what crime bosses do? Keeping his men in line? His X attorney warned us that Donald is a dangerous man. If Jack Smith gives over any information it will be Christmas to Donald. He has shown that he does not follow the rules.
Or has anyone wondered about Ivana's death and subsequent interment at Trump's National Golf Club in Bedminster NJ...? So many questions (and quite a few substantial responses) to the nature of her demise and the reason for choosing Bedminster as her final resting place. See especially the WaPo's Aug. 1, 2022 article about the latter. https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/2022/08/01/ivana-trump-buried-tax-break-grift/
I have always said that her death is very suspicious.
I agree. She was cremated so why is a full casket buried on a golf course? There’s something in that casket & it’s my guess it’s not Ivana.
Dartmouth professor Brooke Harrington, a specialist in tax optimization, checked the New Jersey tax code and reported that operating a cemetery at the Trump National offers “a trifecta of tax avoidance. Property, income & sales tax, all eliminated.” She tweeted that it “looks like one corpse will suffice to make at least 3 forms of tax vanish.”
One purported corpse.
I always wonder why the pallbearers had such trouble with her casket.
I have wondered often. And about Jeffrey Epstein’s death.
This is a silly conspiracy theory. Please don't post that here.
I agree
Your comments triggered this memory
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uuoRRDtdHbY
He is & always has been evil.
Yes Anne, he has always been evil and like I said is capable of the worst we can imagine.
You’re not alone in your thinking. I have imagined that he’s got something on his allied buffoons. Maybe something tied to Jeffery Epstein? Or maybe he threatens these people with the lives of their families. He’s a mean man.
He is an evil man.
Yup!
“If you go after me, I’m coming after you!”
Said every in-danger-of-being-toppled-soon mob boss, ever.
Which makes that mob boss more dangerous than ever. A cornered psychopath is very dangerous because they don't care who they hurt in their attempts to protect themselves. They don't care about people and they don't care about nations.
“They don't care about people…” I’ll take that one step further:
Some psychopaths not only don’t care about other people, there’s a subset that actively takes joy in watching their victims suffer. Unhappily American history is rife with examples.
I don't think Trump necessarily has that in him (he's weak, just an overfed power-monger who can't see beyond his belly or beyond the reach of his stubby little fingers), but it's not the same about the most violent of his followers —who he dispatches on his whims, and then directs.
That was on full display on January 6: who gets off on blinding one cop by poking him in the eye by with a flagpole, or another, by pulling away the officer’s respirator so as to gas the man with bear spray? Those inflicted cruelties weren't necessary, and they had to be recreational in nature.
Bringing us back to the Mob Boss thing: Trump NEVER has to get blood on his hands, and he never does: he counts on his sadistically-inclined sycophants to take care of those kinds of things.
All he ever needs to do is say something like “There are good people on both sides (nudge nudge wink wink, you swastika-flag wavers)”, or “Stand down and stand by!” —which the Oath Keepers took as an emphasis on stand by (and not the “stand down” part). And all he ever needs to hear in return is “I took care of that thing for ya, boss”.
“How's Paulie?”
“ah, Paulie. You won’t see him no more.”
That’s the dangerous part: The invisible hand, impelled by a killer/slave-master mentality.
Agree. He is a mob boss in the sense that he doesn't get his hands dirty, he doesn't do the hard work, he gets others to do it for him. That he is masterful in gathering people who have strong sociopathic and sadistic tendencies (I think he enjoys watching - as we saw on Jan 6) and feels more powerful as he gets these people to put themselves in legal jeopardy for him, that he seems to have a power to bring out the worst in people, and that when people are in groups they are more likely to act in ways they may not individually, AND that he has had the power of the Presidency -- that is a recipe for disaster of major proportions.
Charlie Manson was a psychopath -- but he never murdered anyone himself. He got others to do it for him.
Well put. I overlooked Manson but that’s basically it, isn’t it. Good example.
I had thought to reference (but didn’t want to seem too wordy) that conversation In “The Godfather Part II”, in Hyman Roth's “We’re bigger than US Steel!” speech, where he is explaining to Michael how well-positioned the organization (read: the Mob) was, for future success:
“Just one small step: looking for a man who wants to be President of the United States, and having the cash to make it possible.”
I submit that in 2015 they found that man.
That Trump’s teacher, mentor, and early fixer was Mob lawyer Roy Cohn, speaks volumes to that possibility.
You got it.
A mob boss has always been a dangerous individual.
Typical Roy Cohen to pretty boy Donald remark. Wonder what that relationship was about.
It’s my view that Trump was/is too much of a dull knife to realize that Roy Cohn was gay, if that’s what you might have been wondering about there.*
Apparently Trump dropped him like a hot potato when Cohn de facto got outed when he came down with AIDS, after which Trump never spoke to him again —and I myself don't believe for one second that that cut-off was due to any possible apprehension of Trump about catching the disease from Cohn: Trump doesn't fear viruses, remember? (Besides, even if Trump was afraid of that, he could always have just picked up the phone to wish his friend well.)
*(Although I wouldn't dismiss the possibility of Cohn having some kind of a one-way-street “lust” for Trump —perhaps just a lust for the power he thought Trump held: in retrospect there always did seem to to be a certain “Smithers” / “Mr. Burns” air about their relationship.)
All very plausible. I wrote my book because he was the most bizarre president ever and I’ll never do it again. Now I’ll return to my cat manuscript that I put aside. Aug 5 wow. You did some research
ha. Not really, about either the long dwell-time since August 5th (I only came back here to read this topic again because one other of our fellow scribes commented positively about something else I wrote here, and I wanted to revisit the conversation) or about “did some research”: nope, not really. I try to pay attention, is all, in answer to your (as it were) query.
I've always been an avid listener to NPR —and since retirement, Pacifica stations, and then because I bought a car with a GREAT podcast-collecting function (a car that needs supercharging a lot, which facilitates me uninterrupted listening periods of just drinking in Joyce here, Preet Bharara, and the joys of Heather Cox Richardson in delightfully insightful conversations with Joanne Freeman, those kinds of things… my, we do live in good times.
I’m not writing all of this because I am a self-referential blowhard or do not self-edit well (both offenses which may successfully be levied against me), but because this is the new way of the world.
Some people on my old crew would ask from time to time, “What news do YOU listen to?”, as if there's got to be some new single-point Walter Cronkite or LIFE magazine replacements out there… but of course we know there are not.
And it comes down to things like this, it is THE question of our times, unhappily these times of Rupert Murdoch, Tucker, and pertinently, our previous President, and the answer is: we all have to be our own News Editors these days. Which is kind of an unsatisfactory response to folks who are looking for the new Cronkite, but oh well.
As a matter of fact I learned that Trump/Cohn business from listening to an interview with a writer working for the NY Post, whose beat for -decades- was covering Trump for that tabloid, when T was a merely a rich but dismissible NYC celebrity… I chose to believe this writer because his telling of the story, had veracity, and lined up with all other extant facts about the Orange Man… and that’s how it’s done these days.
hurrah for “Civil Discourse”. And the chickens! There IS hope for our democracy!
I understand. Blogging is relatively new for me. I often write in my weekly for free. I recently figured how to activate the notice me button when someone responds to a comment. I rather communicate in my song lyrics. But that’s a whole other difficult place to break through. Just in case, my YouTube channel is: Catman Bill — Hartford, Connecticut.
Getting my news consists of BBC at 6 TV. Then network news at 6:30 and The News Hour at 7. That mostly ends my TV exposure. I subscribe to the New York Times. I used to subscribe to Washington Post but the permanently banned me for explaining how I would crap on the steps of the US capital one day as Trump was being waked inside. Life goes on. I was a Mother Jones reader paid subscriber too and they once sent me into permanent moderation and after I begged them to lift it but wouldn’t, I asked for my remaining money back. I guess I have a way with words since I wrote what I think is the most scathing anti Trump book in the marketplace. And just came out with a second edition. I am very happy with Joyce Vance and Heather Cox Richardson. They are invaluable to my se se of knowledge. Just last week, I attended an all day Stop Trump symposium at Cooper Union in New York. It was reciting. Everyone was there on stage; George Conway, Mary Trump, Miles Taylor, Michael Cohen the fixer. He was a bit arrogant with me later when I approached him but it’s just New York can deal. Robert DeNero was to speak but he had Covid. And a bunch more.
Hang in there.
At some point, his blustering threats must be met with consequences. Regardless of what anyone on his side believes, he has been warned, and thus far he has NEVER been held responsible for any of his actions, outside of the E. Jean Cameron case. Time to make him pay like any other 2-bit crook. Thanks, Joyce. Carry on.
I’m old enough to remember the word “punk” in reference to unintelligent street hoods. This is what he is, just a punk. We have to remember that he is a child of Brooklyn, NY. My sincere apologies to the wonderful people of Brooklyn.
It also referred to a kept sexual partner in prison who belonged to a powerful daddy.. “Punks” were said to be entitled and arrogant out of fear of their “daddy.” Snotty and intolerable and prone to “accidents.”
I think the fact that he is walking around and not incarcerated is a reflection of our two- tiered system of justice, one for entitled, wealthy people and one for folks with no legal or financial support. Additionally, because of his political position and past presidency, I suspect Smith and the judge fear taking any further action, inflaming his base and bringing further charges of "witch hunt" from delusional or dishonest Republucans. And so for now he can go on being Donald and disregarding normal rules and protocols. I have to remind myself that this is a marathon not a sprint, but oh my gosh I can't WAIT for the trial that will finally bring an end to his criminality and give us the justice we all deserve.
Vote, make calls, write postcards, text, but most importantly, VOTE. we need a big blue wave.
"...but most importantly, VOTE"
Yes, Betsy. Say it loud. Say it often. Write it in letters to editors.
Rinse and repeat.
Yes, Betsy. We must overcome the inertia of this unimaginable situation and DO something to get Blue voters to the polls!
I write postcards through Activate America and letters through Vote Forward. I find both organizations are well organized and very effective. I am disabled and limited in physical activity - so being able to contribute in ways that I can is very satisfying.
I think people would be so stunned if he were incarcerated now that it might snap them back to reality.
As Joyce pointed out, it's more likely to make the hard core Trumpists act out and result in chaos. They have their own reality. If they haven't been jolted out of it by now (many have, I might point out), they never will.
Trump is desperate, and putting him in a cell, as Joyce pointed out, would likely result in delaying the trial- the last thing we want. Better is to keep leaning on him, hard. If he appears to be threatening any actual person, that's another potential charge. The more there are, the more likely he'll back himself so far into the corner he's already in.
I am puzzled though. We're letting a terrorist go free because we're afraid of the result and afraid of his followers. Afraid is the key word here that bugs me. If he's found guilty, he may serve time anyway, so we're just delaying the chaos.
The trial being delayed may not be a problem if he's found guilty. The result of his trial(s) may not happen until after the election. If he is confined without a cell phone, if that's possible, he is limited to telling his visitors what to do for him, and limited to winning or losing the nomination and/or the presidency from confinement. A new twist in the American story.
Sometimes I feel like wake me up when it's over, then I'll deal with it. Trump's megalomania and demagoguery dominates everything important that we need to take care of in this country. If he wins, we'll have more of it for years to come, not to mention the damage Republicans will do.
The tiny percent of wealthy donors and corporations that support Republicans are not afraid of climate change and have no intention of helping ordinary Americans, other than making sure they are able to work when they need a warm body in addition to AI and robots. They may drive out "elite intellectuals" and eliminate objective news programs. The immigration system is too broken for talented immigrants to be admitted to the country. SS and Medicare and Obamacare will be further slashed, making our healthcare system worse than it is now.
I know, it's a dire prediction, but it could actually go darker than that, with a police state and KGB style surveillance with drones and more sophisticated technologies. They might really weaponize the Dept of Justice, going after activists and writers. It happens in other countries.
This is basically a summary of what we have been talking about for months. And it is why it is important that we bring Trumpt to trial according to the processes that have been laid out in law. It is also important, as we keep saying, that we all do what we can to make 2024 a blue election in as many places and at as many levels as we can, doing what we can as we can. To keep that dark future from happening. To prove Democracy works. We the people can win, but not by wringing our hands and visualizing every possible dark outcome and then failing to do everything we can to prevent it. As Joyce reminds us, we are in this together.
Fox "news" is actively lying and brainwashing for votes and possible jurors. That's why you hear so much "free speech" and "election fraud" still to this day, despite the indictment and the endless recounts. Trump's supporters believe the lies and use the same talking points to their peers. That's what's different today than years ago without Fox "news", when someone would lose an election for being unfaithful to their wife.
Yes, it is rather stunning, isn't it?
I think your prediction has a great likelihood of coming true if Trump wins in 2024 and the GOP keeps the House and takes the Senate. We will cease to be a democracy and go the way of Hungary and Poland and become an authoritarian state. Liberals have been warning for years about climate change and have been ridiculed as hyperbolic. We're literally in it now. And there's no going back. We have to keep up the fight, take the threat seriously. The vote is our strongest voice. For now.
Fox "news" is actively lying, gaslighting and brainwashing for votes, and reaching possible jurors.
I agree!
Let us stay in prayer.
For what, please? Sometimes the answer to prayer is "this one's on you, kid". It's up to us to do what needs to be done, not just wait for "somebody" to fix things. As Betsy said in her post, "Vote, make calls, write postcards, text, but most importantly, VOTE." It's not just Trump we need to worry about. It's how the election turns out. The time to start that work is now. All up and down the ballot.
Why can’t she issue a gag order to prevent him from saying ANYTHING about the case or about ANYONE involved in it?
Because he won't abide by it. It took less than 36 hours for him to outright defy the judge's orders. The only way to keep him silent is to make sure he doesn't have a phone, a tablet, a computer, or any way to speak out and/or publish his vile speech. The only way to do that is from a jail cell where the environment is completely contained.
Exactly. Issue the gag order and as soon as he violates it (which will probably be within 5 minutes) lock his ass up.
YES, YES, YES!
Oh for heaven's sake. Enough is enough. This guy is dangerous. Lock him up and take that damn phone away. Toddlers are more mature than this blister on society.
Trump is more like a supperating boil on the nation's behind. A blister implies that there might have been actual work involved--and we all know Trump is allergic to actual work.
I stand corrected!!
But you are right on the money pointing out that Trump is less emotionally mature than a toddler!
Lock. Him. Up.
Knew it would come but that sure didn't take long!!!
The rapid response by trump is like a kid saying “make me” to the judge. I hope there is a swift and appropriate response. Everyone is watching
Trump is just mad because of the unflattering arraignment day photos--one showing bad hair and liddle hands and o l d all in the same shot. That’s exactly the kind of thing that would make a guy like him sound off with a nasty threat.
No, he’s mad because his attorney introduced him as “President Trump” in his arraignment and the judge addressed him as “Mr. Trump”. He’s just a plain ole guy like us chickens and it makes him sick. Good!
hahahahahahahahahaha absolutely. "Make me."
Hum... why this move. This is a chess game. Why this move? He wants violence it seems to me.
Because he LOVES creating conflict and chaos.
He's a clear threat. LOCK HIM UP.
Menacing- that is the primary stance that malignant narcissistic authoritarians like trump always project out at and into their victims, as they relentlessly dominate others through inflicting inescapable fear. It’s the instilling of constant terror in every family member to obtain total submission to the abuser that I’ve seen, that mirrors trump’s menacing presence writ large. The message is- “If you ever challenge my power and authority over you in any way, you will pay severely- there is no escaping the harm I can and will inflict on you.” Of course this is the classic way that ruthless rulers and dictators have operated throughout history. As trump enters his nightmare of having to sit silently in court day after day for weeks on end, as scores of witnesses reveal the details of his crimes, it’s quite possible he will become so filled with inchoate rage, that he will become emotionally incapacitated and be unable to function. I’m not wishing that on him at all, but for inflated, grandiose and predatory narcissists like him, the ordeal ahead where he will feel so helpless and powerless, is really going to be a horror. For me, I hope justice is fairly served. I will always mourn the hundreds of thousands of Americans that needlessly died because of his criminal and heartless negligence during the pandemic when he was president.
I love this cogent detailed response. I think he knows that folks are lining up to testify against him - and thus, to save their own skins. He has already been sending threatening messages (perhaps through his minions). He recently asked whether employee 4 (Taveras?) was loyal. When his assistant Walt made inquiries and went back to Trump with 'Yes, he is loyal,' Trump told him he would hire an attorney for him. Everything is contingent on his having unquestioned loyalty. I am wondering - and it's ok if you have no answer - but if Walt has been witness to Trump's threats and making others 'pay severely' perhaps he is frightened? Also, is there a way to know if he is truly 'emotionally incapacitated and unable to function'? Is one able to fake that kind of behavior? And who would determine if that were the case? I know the court may order a psychiatric examination, but how would they choose the psychiatrist? Is there a list of the 'best' in the field, such as they have for heart surgeons and such? Do they just 'know' these things and have a list of who to call? I have thought for a couple of weeks that he might fake a scenario of some kind that would have Ivanka or someone admit him to a psychiatric hospital to avoid the court trial. But you are suggesting it is an actual possibility for a 'narcissist authoritarian' like Trump. I mourn as well the hundreds of thousands of Americans that needlessly died because of his negligence. When he became ill with Covid, he had the best of emergency care and after-care (he had a litany of expensive herbal supplements and IV treatments to which the average person did not have access). Still: his behavior was "I'm on board, pull up the ladder." He had the best care but did not promote mask wearing, distancing, or vaccines. I also mourn as well the ruined careers of distinguished government workers, career military officers, and career diplomats all of whom he demeaned and caused to resign (or he fired them and proceeded to 'smear' them). I mourn the business executives who resigned from their firms and put businesses on hold to accept cabinet positions (in good faith), but to learn first-hand what a dictator he was and that he would not make decisions as a team player. While the invaders of the Capitol were thugs, and most may never have opened a civics book (or, it didn't 'take'), they did as they did because they trusted Trump. Many are broken and in jail. We can ask: 'What were they thinking?' I really don't know - but there may have been a profile that Trump discovered among them and then he was able to 'rope them in.' A kind of cult personality. They seemed to have (and some still do) as a multi-level sales business: 'Do this because so and so is doing it." It is just a grifting Ponzi scheme. So finally, if/when he becomes emotionally incapacitated, it solves the problem of whether he can run the country if he is elected after being convicted. He would be found mentally incompetent, whether elected or not.
Valere I’m grateful for your caring and mourning for the countless people harmed by trump. I wouldn’t be surprised that by the second or third week in court he began to become psychologically and emotionally overwhelmed. I can’t say what would happen then. For his sake i hope that doesn’t happen- and for the sake of justice being fully carried out too.
His niece is a psychologist, and has written a couple of books that go into this. She has made much the same call you have, but in detail and from the inside. She is a brave and thoughtful person, herself damaged as the result of the Trump family dynamics. Many of us have a better sense of his malignant narcissism as a result of her willingness to write a difficult story.
Thank you Annie- yes, Mary Trump has done a great service in sharing her knowledge and warnings about trump.
Valerie What a beautiful & thorough description of the extent of the damage he has done & the lives he has hurt or even destroyed. The extent is breathtaking.
Yes, thank you, for reminding everyone that it was his negligence during the pandemic that caused so many deaths and prolonged the life of the virus!
Agreed. Severe personality disorders are brittle & incapable of adaptation. His personality structure is fragmenting the more he is cornered & is likely to tip further into dysfunction eg psychoticism, in my opinion. His cronies who enable him make him more dangerous.
Thank you Joyce. Yes, his dangerous power is sustained by corrupt leaders like McCarthy, Graham and others who enable him.
There was a disturbance in Union Square NYC this afternoon. It involved numerous police cars rushing through our nearby neighborhood to establish order. One of my neighbors and I discussed it later in the evening. We both thought his supporters were either protesting or attacking. Reality is the incident had nothing to do with him, but suspect these thoughts and reactions will occur frequently during the rest of the Summer and beyond.
Thank you Joyce for informing how each step, and response, should happen as a reaction to his abhorrent message on a social network.
He cannot stop "crimeing"